Accidentally Vegan...
While searching for an easy vegan Apple Crumb Cake recipe, I found a website that listed lots of "accidentally vegan" convenience foods. PETA has one, too, but their list was different. I was interested in using a cake mix, but none were listed on PETA's list (although Duncan Hines was on the other list). So, I emailed Pinnacle Foods (Duncan Hines) and got this reply:
Thank you for taking the time to email us. In response to your email, all
of our Duncan Hines Cake Mixes and Frostings are derived from plant.
EXCEPT our Signature Dessert Orange Dreamsickle which the Jell-O is
derived from animal. Contact us again if we can be of assistance in the
future.
So, along the same lines as the vegan makeup thread, has anyone else contacted a company to inquire about vegan options?
Good news about Mike & Ike's:
Dear Aimee,
We received your recent e-mail from www.justborn.com.
We can appreciate your concern, and we apologize if there was any confusion. We do not use beeswax as an ingredient in our MIKE AND IKE® candies, and I am unable to find it listed anywhere on our website. If you could point out to me where it is listed, I will forward it on to our website management team for review.
Again, thank you for taking the time to contact us and for your interest in Just Born candies.
Regards,
Lisa Guzzo
Just Born, Inc.
Consumer Relations Department
:) Yay, lurve mike and ikes (found them by accident whilst on hols in Vegas a coupla years), I like the sours best. I loved them so much I kept buying boxes during my hols there, on returning to the UK I tried to find a UK-based supplier - there weren't any :'( - I had to ration my sweeties ... until a friend went to America to see family and brought me some back ... then I was back on rations to make them last longer ... until the same friend found them at a specialist imported sweet shop ... Yay! ;D
I don't know if anybody really cares but me :D but here's the response I received from Lipton's Recipe secrets:
Hello Stumbleene,
Thanks for writing!
Most of our soups contain meat, meat derivatives, or dairy products.
Here are some exceptions :
MEAT, DAIRY & EGG FREE:
RECIPE SECRETS:
- Onion
- Onion Mushroom
- Vegetable
MEAT FREE, WITH DAIRY AND/OR EGGS:
CUP-A-SOUP:
- Broccoli & Cheese
- Cream of Mushroom
- Spring Vegetable
- Tomato
Ingredients of animal origin may be listed as meat (e.g., chicken or
beef), fat (as in chicken fat), extract
(such as beef extract, broth, or natural flavors). But, we checked with
our brand management, and they informed us that the natural flavors may
or may not be derived from animal origin. There are many mixtures that
we purchase from hundreds of flavor suppliers. If the you are
uncomfortable about the natural flavorings used they recommend that you
do not use the product as we cannot guarantee that it is not of animal
origin.
We hope this information is helpful.
Kind regards
Your friends at Unilever
wsh
Good news about Mike & Ike's:
Dear Aimee,
We received your recent e-mail from www.justborn.com.
We can appreciate your concern, and we apologize if there was any confusion. We do not use beeswax as an ingredient in our MIKE AND IKE® candies, and I am unable to find it listed anywhere on our website. If you could point out to me where it is listed, I will forward it on to our website management team for review.
Again, thank you for taking the time to contact us and for your interest in Just Born candies.
Regards,
Lisa Guzzo
Just Born, Inc.
Consumer Relations Department
Funny, this is the response I got:
Dear Ms. Hollar,
Thank you for your recent email.
We can tell you that beeswax is not an ingredient in our candies, however, it is used to line the pans during processing.
Thank you for your taking the time to contact us.
Regards,
Allyson Greer
Just Born, Inc.
Consumer Relations Department
Oh, man! I can't believe that!
You'd think with the point I made about not wanting to exploit animals, she might have thought to mention that...
Good news about Mike & Ike's:
Dear Aimee,
We received your recent e-mail from www.justborn.com.
We can appreciate your concern, and we apologize if there was any confusion. We do not use beeswax as an ingredient in our MIKE AND IKE® candies, and I am unable to find it listed anywhere on our website. If you could point out to me where it is listed, I will forward it on to our website management team for review.
Again, thank you for taking the time to contact us and for your interest in Just Born candies.
Regards,
Lisa Guzzo
Just Born, Inc.
Consumer Relations Department
Hmmm...I wrote Just Born Candy back because I was not satisfied with the response I got the first time ("We can tell you that beeswax is not an ingredient in our candies, however, it is used to line the pans during processing.") Even though the fact that it is used in the processing of the product is enough to keep me away from it, I still didn't think it was okay to omit it from the ingredients' list if residual beeswax ends up on the product. This is the response I got:
"I am not familiar with the segment you referred to seeing on The Food Network. What I can tell you is that we use beeswax not as an ingredient, but as a processing aid and that is why it is not listed as an ingredient. Processing aids are commonly used in food products and are permitted by the FDA. More specific information about processing aids and regulations governing them can be found by referring to the Code of Federal Regulations 21CFR 170.3.
While it does come in contact with the candy, it should not become part of the finished product.
I hope this additional information is helpful.
Regards,
Lisa Guzzo
Just Born, Inc.
Consumer Relations Manager"
Same person as you! However, in your response, she acted like she had no idea why beeswax was being talked about at all...as if it had nothing to do with the manufacturing of their product. Funny, huh?
p.s. How do you like the line "it should not become part of the finished product"? Should not? How's that for a noncommittal response!
Wow, you are a diligent researcher! I looked up the code she referred to, and came across this website, which I think is very interesting:
http://www.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/cfrassemble.cgi?title=200321
It has all of the federal regulations for food and drugs. The regulations for food labeling are here: http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/waisidx_03/21cfr101_03.html
I was able to find the regulation that says it's ok to list "natural flavoring" instead of "extract of dead animals" (not quite in those words :)) This is an interesting read if you are looking for procrastination activities like I am!
Wow..I'm really confused about Duncan Hines. On the back of every cake mix I looked at it says it contains milk. Why would they write saying only the jello and orange cake contain animal ingredients?
Be careful with PETA's "accidentally vegan" list because not all of those products are still vegan.
Oh, I am...I don't take their word for anything! That's why I contacted Pinnacle (Duncan Hines). I've tried contacting PETA about "vegan" items on their list that aren't. For instance, Hot Tamales are on the list. I was watching Food Channel and they were showing how these are made and they are tumbled in beeswax (for the shiny finish and to keep them from sticking to each other). I told PETA that and they said that since it's such a small thing, they will leave it on the list. They said that at least it's better than most things that have more animal derived ingredients. That doesn't fly for me. It's wrong to misrepresent something as vegan unless it is in the strictest sense of the word (or at least make a disclaimer). The other one was P.F. Chang's (which is on their vegan-friendly restaurant list). I used to go there all the time and get their Coconut Curry Vegetables and Ma Po Tofu. Once, I decided to ask if they could make General Tso's Chicken with tofu instead. They said yes, but I began wondering if the sauce was vegan. When I got there, I asked and the server said "none of our sauces are vegan...they all have an ingredient derived from bone marrow". I was appalled! I was ordering from the vegetarian menu and when I first went in, I asked if the sauces were vegan and were told that they were. I went back later to complain and the manager tried to assure me that the sauces were vegan. After some prodding, she said she'd check. She emailed me later to confirm that they aren't. I forwarded the email to PETA and nothing happened. P.F. Chang's is still listed as vegan-friendly.
p.s. The kicker: a vegan joined our staff at work a few months ago and we talked about P.F. Chang's. He went there and spoke to a manager who...you guessed it...assured him that the sauces are vegan! He eats there, despite what I told him because he believes the manager...I think it's an outrage. That's why I seldom eat out.
Maybe I should start a new thread, but thought this tied in well enough...
A "Noodles & Company" opened near my home and so I thought I'd email, asking if any of their menu items are vegan. Kara and I went back and forth via email, and, after much hemming and hawing, she ended our conversation with this:
"Susan,
I’m sorry I wasn’t able to get back to you sooner. Because we source ingredients from around the world and some people recognize a vegan diet differently than others, I cannot tell you for certain that these ingredients are vegan. I would hate to tell you that an ingredient was vegan when it might contain ingredients that you would like to avoid. For this reason, Noodles & Company does not claim that any dishes are vegan. I am sorry that I cannot be more helpful in my explanation.
Kara"
Shame, huh? I sent this as my final response:
"That's too bad. I suppose we vegans are in a very small, therefore insignificant, minority and restaurants are more interested in catering to the masses and can't be bothered with trying to accommodate such a minuscule portion of the population. I had hopes for a restaurant that has some Asian dishes, since many Asians, because of religious practices, are vegan, or, at least, vegetarian. I have so much trouble finding places to eat when I go out. P.F. Chang's, for instance, told me their vegetarian dishes were vegan, only to find out years later that nearly all their sauces contain an ingredient derived from bone marrow (hardly vegetarian, let alone vegan).
For what it's worth, I would suggest that Noodles & Company strive to provide at least one dish that's vegan and labeled as such (even if it's a typical "Buddha's something" dish!).
Thanks for your time,
Susan
p.s. I'm still not sure why you keep talking along the lines of "some people recognize a vegan diet differently than others". I'm telling you that anything that contains ingredients that are animal-derived is NOT vegan and I've never encountered anything labeled as "vegan" that does."
Not sure why I bothered, but I suppose it made me feel better...
-Susan
Didn't get a response on this...wondering if anyone else is frustrated with trying to go out to eat. I've gotten to the point that I don't trust any restaurants to be vegan, even if they claim to be. Now, I'm going to Vancouver for a week and I'm wondering what to do...
Any suggestions?
My suggestion to anyone who is flying is to be careful of the airplane food that claims to be vegetarian. My last time on a plane I was not vegan, but lacto-ovo (even though I avoided cheese in public places because of possible rennet). The people arranging the trip did not know vegan options were available, and so the vegetarian meal seemed like it would be fine for me. But there was gelatin in the yogurt!! I was really shocked when I got my breakfast to find that out! So my advice to the vegetarians out there is to order the vegan meal anyway, just in case. I am now vegan since then and will be trying my first vegan airplane food in the near future. The name of the meal is "vegetarian - nondairy" so I hope that also means no egg or all the other stuff we try to avoid...I will be bringing my own food too but this is a LONG flight...
Now, I'm going to Vancouver for a week and I'm wondering what to do...
Any suggestions?
Kittymommy: Vancouver is an incredibly veg friendly place so you don't have to worry about finding vegan food there. (check happycow)
Have fun
On airlines i ask for the strict vegetarian meal. The word vegan doesn't really seem to convey meaning, at least to Air Canada. The strict vegetarian comes with almost no dairy, you usually get non vegan marg to spread on your roll.
"That's too bad. I suppose we vegans are in a very small, therefore insignificant, minority and restaurants are more interested in catering to the masses and can't be bothered with trying to accommodate such a minuscule portion of the population. I had hopes for a restaurant that has some Asian dishes, since many Asians, because of religious practices, are vegan, or, at least, vegetarian. I have so much trouble finding places to eat when I go out. P.F. Chang's, for instance, told me their vegetarian dishes were vegan, only to find out years later that nearly all their sauces contain an ingredient derived from bone marrow (hardly vegetarian, let alone vegan).
For what it's worth, I would suggest that Noodles & Company strive to provide at least one dish that's vegan and labeled as such (even if it's a typical "Buddha's something" dish!).
Thanks for your time,
Susan
p.s. I'm still not sure why you keep talking along the lines of "some people recognize a vegan diet differently than others". I'm telling you that anything that contains ingredients that are animal-derived is NOT vegan and I've never encountered anything labeled as "vegan" that does."
Not sure why I bothered, but I suppose it made me feel better...
-Susan
FWIW... she's looking out for her business, and I can't say I see anything wrong with that, as it sounds like this is just a regular old business, not one claiming to be vegan, but where you are looking for vegan options.
Do you really think they could make an offering that they could claim is not only consistantly vegan, but vegan enough for everyone?
For every vegan who may be perfectly happy to accept XYZ as vegan - there will be another who will say "Yes, but the COULD be animal derived." Or say, in the case of sugar, processed using animal bones as charcoal (sp). It might NOT be, but it COULD be.
Say this place were to offer a vegan dish but then one week they are only able to get a certain ingredient from a different supplier. Maybe there are now subtle differences which would make the menu item unacceptable to some, not unacceptable to others. Unless they have staff on hand who understand all the intricacies of what might and might not be vegan, I can see why they wouldn't want to guarantee a dish's vegan-ness. (Is that a word?)
Maybe the best you can do, if eating at a more mainstream establishment, is know the ingredient list, understand that suppliers might change, understand what "risks" there may be with choosing to consume certain ingredients, know that you are making your best effort, and then act accordingly.
If eating a certain way is important to you, than any time you go to an eating establishment that doesn't cater specifically to that lifestyle, you are running the risk of falling short of your ideals. A piece of pork could fall in your bean burrito. Your hummus and sprout sandwich could be cut with the same knife just used to cut someone else's turkey and cheese. Barring food allergies, which could be life threatening and if so probably preclude the risks of eating in such an outside establishment in the first place, it's not so much about being perfect as making the best choices you can based on what you know. Small slips which you have no control over do not necessarily change the importance of your intent provided you are acting to the best of your ability.
I think it's better (more honest) for her to say such a guarantee or offering is not possible, than to stretch the truth and risk an uproar in the future.
I think it's better (more honest) for her to say such a guarantee or offering is not possible, than to stretch the truth and risk an uproar in the future.
Good point. I could include prior correspondence where I very clearly explain what I consider vegan, but that wouldn't eliminate the possibility, like you said, that the ingredients could change and the dish would no longer be vegan. I guess I just get frustrated that restaurants aren't a little more accommodating when it comes to veganism. It is worse when you are told something is vegan, only to be told later that it's not (in the case of PF Chang's). Even restaurants offering vegan options have let me down. Northstar Cafe here in Columbus, Ohio has vegan options, so I went there and ordered a Buddha Bowl with tofu, not even thinking about asking if it was vegan (I thought that was implied by the name!). Later, I found out that it has honey in it. I still don't understand that one!
I think you did a great thing! You made this company aware of something that perhaps they hadn't thought of before. Consider it vegan advertising!
This isn't traditional fruitcake, it's a fruity, nutty moist cake that's accidentally vegan. It looks good.
Grandma Leach's Fruitcake
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