Kucinich for President 2008 (NVR)
I didn't want to co-opt the thread on Kucinich's food poisoning. So I've started a new one because I think everyone should look at his position on the issues:
Particularly read the paper he submitted to Congress in 2002 stating the reasons why the U.S. should *not* go to war in Iraq. He said everythng that's been brought out since the war turned "sour" on us way before it happened. If more than 125 Democrats had taken it seriously and voted against the war from the get-go, we wouldn't be in the horrible mess we're in now. Even my hawkish, veteran of 20 years in the U.S. Army, DH is saying now that it's all been a big mistake: http://kucinich.us/files/pdfs/Oct2002Analysis.pdf
His work on repealing the so-called Patriot Act is also a good read:
http://kucinich.us/issues/patriot_act.php
Also if you have time, read up on the health care bill he's co-sponsoring with John Conyers:
http://kucinich.us/issues/universalhealth.php
Don't just support him because he's vegan, support him because so far he seems to be the best candidate, IMHO. 8)
Another white, just-out-of-middle-age, straight man, and roman catholic to boot! How original. He may be all for animal rights, etc., but what about women's rights?? His record on Choice is rather pitiful, and he seems to have only recently "changed his mind" (!) on the issue... !
More of the same.
Yawn...
I understand your post... but it's wrong to say that being a Catholic president isn't original. There has only been one Roman Catholic US president- JFK. I can relate to being flip-floppy on the issue of abortion, especially being raised Catholic as well, they really do drill pro-lifeness into your head when you're young. I guess if abortion is your main issue, then he isn't for you, but his anti-war and pro-environment policies are original, sincere and progressive.
Calling Ron Paul's stance pro-evironment is dodgy at best. He wants environmental groups to be like consume radvocacy groups. To suggest and to make people aware when someone is polluting. However, he against any goverment regulation or enforcement when it comes to big business vs. the environment.
You see, the thing about Ron Paul (aside from being racist) is that he is a borderline libertarian. He wants no interference on corporations, no federal regulation of any sort. He believes a business model is the best for everything. He's sort of an uber-capitalist, from what I know. And while capitalism is nifty, left unchecked, it can be as bad as any other political system.
Another white, just-out-of-middle-age, straight man, and roman catholic to boot! How original. He may be all for animal rights, etc., but what about women's rights?? His record on Choice is rather pitiful, and he seems to have only recently "changed his mind" (!) on the issue... !
More of the same.
Yawn...
So who do you think is the best candidate and why?
You see, the thing about Ron Paul (aside from being racist) is that he is a borderline libertarian. He wants no interference on corporations, no federal regulation of any sort. He believes a business model is the best for everything. He's sort of an uber-capitalist, from what I know. And while capitalism is nifty, left unchecked, it can be as bad as any other political system.
I, myself, am at heart an idealistic libertarian. I really believe in it, in principle... but ONLY if the entire system works that way. You can't place one or two or even a dozen libertarian ideals on our current society and expect it to work. Which is the only way it'd ever be done and therefore ends up as sucky.
Interesting random side-note on government involvment:
Did you know that Russia today has far less government run anything than the USA? We have so much subsidizing plus there's the government run companies, like the US postal system etc. But Russia doesn't. Not saying it's good or bad. Just interesting since most people assume a former communist state would have more government involvement than we do.
Small side-track...
I'm cool with the idea of libertarians. To be one - a real one - takes commitment, foresight and planning. Also, a great deal more faith in ones fellow humans than I can muster.
What gets me are these ashamed-they-drank-the-neo-conservative-Kool-Aid "libertarians". Best way to get them to hush is to ask what their plan would be if their house catches on fire, or just how they would use their saved taxes to maintain their section of the roads. And what they'd do if someone else didn't take care of their roads.
More secret surveillance programs revealed, Pelossi rolling over, majority whip announcing in the Washington Post dems will not vote to withdraw troops if Sept report shows progress, etc.
No more lesser of two evils. When Kucinich doesn't make it past the primaries I'm writing him in come November.
More secret surveillance programs revealed, Pelossi rolling over, majority whip announcing in the Washington Post dems will not vote to withdraw troops if Sept report shows progress, etc.
No more lesser of two evils. When Kucinich doesn't make it past the primaries I'm writing him in come November.
Yes, it has gotten quite bad, hasn't it?
Small side-track...
I'm cool with the idea of libertarians. To be one - a real one - takes commitment, foresight and planning. Also, a great deal more faith in ones fellow humans than I can muster.
What gets me are these ashamed-they-drank-the-neo-conservative-Kool-Aid "libertarians". Best way to get them to hush is to ask what their plan would be if their house catches on fire, or just how they would use their saved taxes to maintain their section of the roads. And what they'd do if someone else didn't take care of their roads.
That's why half-assing it doesn't work. You can't just be a libertarian if you want pot legalized, you have to be a responsible individiual and have a responsible society. Social Darwinism baby! Which will never happen because we have a government safety net right now.
KUCINICH:
http://ontheissues.org/Dennis_Kucinich.htm
You know I really like Kucinich but as I look over his voting record there are just some things that don't add up... they aren't huge "important" issues but some seem odd to me...
Voted NO on protecting the Pledge of Allegiance. (Sep 2004) <--- yay
Voted YES on constitutional amendment prohibiting flag desecration. (Jun 2003) <--- ? huh?
I know he is currently pro-choice, but his past on that issue makes me nervous. I'd like to hear more about why he changed his mind (anyone have a link to that kind of info?)
I should probably just take it at face value, huh?
Maybe this will help:
http://www.cleveland.com/kucinich/plaindealer/index.ssf?/kucinich/more/1045488643215370.html
Highlighs for those who don't want to make with the clicky:
As a personally pro-life pro-choice supporter, I can sympathise. I feel it is sad when alife never gets a chance. However, I respect someone's right to make that very difficult choice. It's not always - or even mostly - a case of wanting the baby or not...
It really is strange to hear that comment from a politician, and not a type of runaround or excuse.
That dialogue led me to wholeheartedly support a woman's right to choose."
wow... "wholeheartedly"?
wholeheartedly is not a flip-flop :) it's WHOLEHEARTEDLY.
i don't get the whole flip-flop deal... people aren't allow to change their minds? LOL Maybe that's a provision of the patriot act that I wasn't aware of. ;)
Thanks tofuttibreak, that quote really helped me feel better about the whole thing. soooo... I'm thinking, if the election were today he'd have my vote.
i just wanted to bump this because i was talking about kucinich with someone the other day and i don't watch tv or do much news hounding, unfortunately, so i wanted to see how everything was going with him.
i feel like a lot of people still haven't heard of him. and that makes me sad :'(. does anyone feel differently?
I think he is one of the better candidates, on many issues, including abortion. Yes, his recent change of heart is somewhat worrisome, but if he's being truthful, it gives me hope for the future. Suffice it to say, he'd have my vote.
Unfortunately, I don't know how likely he is to make it into the white house. Ron Paul is getting a lot of support, but mistakenly so, for many of the reasons cited already in this thread.
I think he is one of the better candidates, on many issues, including abortion. Yes, his recent change of heart is somewhat worrisome, but if he's being truthful, it gives me hope for the future. Suffice it to say, he'd have my vote.
Unfortunately, I don't know how likely he is to make it into the white house. Ron Paul is getting a lot of support, but mistakenly so, for many of the reasons cited already in this thread.
that is what i was worried about. i am trying to seep out the kucinich word. i feel like he is someone even a lot of younger more apathetic people might like because he is so non-mainstream with his politics, so i think if his work were out there a lot of people would like him.
Unfortunately, I don't know how likely he is to make it into the white house. Ron Paul is getting a lot of support, but mistakenly so, for many of the reasons cited already in this thread.
This scares me SO much. I was reading over his platform the other day and...eee. It makes me really uncomfortable that he believes the federal government shouldn't regulate education and marriage rights. Um, education NEEDS to have standard levels set across the board. Goodness gracious. And, giving states the power to make marriage laws? Hello, we've seen how that doesn't work in the past! A moment a person in a same sex marriage steps out a state in which same sex marriage is legal, their marriage is more or less null and void.
Coincidentally, he also voted against funding unmarried couple adoption which means no same-sex couples can adopt. This angers me a great deal. If two people of reasonable means and character want to adopt and give a child a loving home and greater opportunities...seriously, what the fark!?
And, Ron Paul can take his stance on abortion and keep it miles and miles from my uterus. Hmph! Giving states the power to legislate birth rights is just asking for a woman's CONSTITUTIONAL rights to be trodden on! This man has been identified as a Constitutionalist. Has he not read Roe v. Wade? It's based on the Effing Bill of Effing Rights, part of the Effing Constitution!
I'm sorry for hijacking this thread for a rant on how I'm really wetting myself with worry that Ron Paul has a decent chance of getting elected. His online press blitz and grassroots support scares the dickens out of me.
But, really, can we also talk about how cool Elizabeth Kucinich is? She got her Master's in International Conflict, got a certificate for peace studies, volunteered with the Red Cross to help refugees... I think she'd make a stellar first lady!
At first I was like, uh oh! A political thread ::) But everyone here is so civil! I started reading Kucinich's site and now I'm going through transcripts and videos. I like him. I'm not huge on politics though so I cant really say more.
I find it disappointing that people get worried or angered by his position change on abortion. I think some changes in position is natural, especially before being elected.
One of the things I was surprised about was that hes interested in inacting single-player health care. My father, whos an optometrist (and republican), would be very disappointed to know I am more than willing to vote for someone who supports such a healthcare system... But I have heard his arguments, and I've long felt that he's biased. I've gone on a lot of business trips with him and met other optometrists, two who moved to the US from Canada to get away from their medical system. Apparently they feel that under such a system optometrists (and no doubt other doctors) have less financial opportunities and the pay is not based on quality of work, which leaves such systems with inept optometric care. Seeing how this is all said while enjoying 'business' trips paid by for-profit vision providers, I honestly wouldn't take their viewpoint into consideration.
I work at an optometry clinic though and I can tell you right now that the government assisted plans are extremely difficult and frustrating to deal with and provide the least money to the doctors for their services. Bureaucracy can be frustrating, but all in all I think it is worth it for those who are in need, and I am pleased with Kucinich on all other accounts so tada! You got another supporter! Even if hes not doing too well :P
What can we do to help him? Ron Paul, a candidate that scares the bejesus out of a lot of us is gaining grass roots and internet generated support. If we like this man, what can we do to support him?
I'm tired of watching things happen to this country. I want to make things happen.
Go to his webbsite and sign up for his email newsletters. They will send info and ways to help.
http://www.dennis4president.com/
that is what i am wondering, too, cutething. i just heard he was in my town a few weeks ago and i am so mad i didn't know about it. i totally would have been spreading the word. i guess only about 80 people showed up :-\.
i was actually even thinking about donating ( not that i ahve a whole lot of money) because he is campaigning w/o corporate support (which i applaud). other than that, i want to be one of those obnoxious people handing out literature or something.
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