Dear Vegweb.......something that really bothers me.
First of all I truly do not mean to offend anyone here –just offer up something that has been really bothering me lately. I also don’t mean it to be a debate – so I ‘m not posting it on the debate thread.
I have been a member of VW for a long time. I’m not the most frequent poster, but I do like to read the boards and truly admire and appreciate the respect with which people treat each other. In the last couple of months, however, I have noticed that a great many threads somehow take a turn into sexual innuendo – or just outright discussion of sex.
And I know, I know, if I don’t want to be part of it I can choose not to read it – and often I don’t. But it sometimes pops up randomly in the middle of an otherwise food or chat-related thread I am enjoying. And it sometimes highjacks another thread altogether.
I’m not meaning this a as a judgement or lecture or sermon or anything else – I just wanted to express that this makes me sad and sometimes even kind of angry to hear sex thrown around so flippantly. I KNOW not everyone shares my viewpoint on this and I don’t expect them to – but I have a really hard time understanding how one can be so casual about the only thing that they can give to another person that is uniquely theirs. Additionally, I strongly believe that even though one may not initially realize or admit it, there are a lot of emotional and psychological consequences to cheapening sex to something purely physical and meaningless – maybe not right away – but further down the road. At the very least, this seems like it should be a private discussion be treated with a little bit of discretion and reverence. As a person who did not get to choose where and when to give that part of myself away – I know that part of this is my own issue – and I am dealing with that in the best way I know how. I am a much stronger person than I was six months ago and even typing this is taking a LOT of guts for me.
Again, this is not meant to be a finger-point, accusation or judgement. In many other areas of my life I agree to disagree peacefully, and this is no different. Even though I am sure I am in the minority here, I just really felt the need to express my true viewpoint on this.
Peace,
PP
some people may be disgusted or uncomfortable with the topic of passing gas, but there is a whole thread devoted to it.
:-[ That's my thread... :-[
I think the most exciting threads lately have been about cornbread........ :)
some people may be disgusted or uncomfortable with the topic of passing gas, but there is a whole thread devoted to it.
:-[ That's my thread... :-[
sorry - i needed an example & i didn't think the 'i can has cheeseburger' thread would really make my point. (your thread doesnt offend me though, still flat)
i've seen them! i just stop looking at them for the most part. i might have chimed in once though. its just like the drama about a year ago. i would just make mental notes about what the threads turned into and then just stopped reading them. *shrug* whatever.
Like I said before, my intention in posting this was not to debate about the point or purpose of sex. Nor will I identify specific thread examples, as I do not want to appear to point fingers or embarrass people who have participated in those threads. I will say that I can think of at least three non-open threads that this has happened in the last two months involving discussion of people’s private sex lives, sexual innuendo/jokes, or sexual innuendo related to foods or objects.
One thing I am working on as a person as part of healing myself is being more assertive about things I feel strongly about. It is general knowledge that politics and religion (as someone mentioned, Kate, I believe) are touchy topics – and it’s kind of a given when you bring these up that someone will be offended. Consequently, you think before you post whatever you want or consciously post it in a different spot (i.e. private conversation or debate forum). It doesn’t seem to me that the same holds true for sexually related discussion. I guess since I never see the opposite viewpoint expressed here at all and as there seemed to be increasing amounts of sexual discussion, I just didn’t want everyone to assume it was a mutually comfortable topic for a public forum.
Then there’s the idea of it being a public forum and us all being adults. Yes, I do agree that one can avoid threads with obviously sexual titles and skim through other stuff you don’t want to read. However, unlike religious or political ideas, sex is an act that takes two people – its not only or entirely yours. There’s another person involved, a human being with feelings that deserves dignity and respect. Maybe it meant nothing to you – but maybe it meant a lot to the other person. Would you want something that personal available to the whole world? That’s why I feel uncomfortable with it appearing so often on a public forum. Also – you don’t have to be an adult to read these boards. And while I would by no means classify Vegweb as even remotely sexually explicit – the fact is that you don’t know who is reading this. Teachers – would you want your students coming across this stuff? Parents – your kids?
Please understand that I am not saying sex is bad and we should never discuss it – perhaps just some discretion about the time and the place and the content that we choose to bring up. Again, I am truly truly not trying to make anyone feel bad, start a debate, or point fingers.
I love Vegweb and I have learned a great many useful things, as well as enjoyed the camaraderie and community. As with so many other things discussed on here, I’m merely trying to express my thoughts on something that is just as important to me as my veganism. Also, I hope that by doing that perhaps I have created some awareness that there is another (albeit often silent) viewpoint on this issue.
Peace,
PP
Yea, I'd have to say I enjoy the freedom on this forum with discussing generally-known-as embarrassing things, but perhaps some things should be kept to forum topics (like how people debate in the debating section)?... Come on, why not just make a topic for the sexual stuff? Wouldn't that satisfy everyone?
But yea.. I don't know how anyone feels, so I shouldn't bud in.
why don't we all agree to keep sex topics to the aimless chit chat thread, open letters, and any new threads with names that you would know not to open if you aren't interested. That should be easy enough.
But it's been so boring around here lately, that I doubt it will be much of a problem..........
why don't we all agree to keep sex topics to the aimless chit chat thread, open letters, and any new threads with names that you would know not to open if you aren't interested. That should be easy enough.
But it's been so boring around here lately, that I doubt it will be much of a problem..........
That sounds fine. And the Moratorium, by its very nature.
I haven't posted here much lately, but the topic-specific threads I've been on (books, boot-camp, LOL cats, what did you eat today, anything off of the debate board) haven't switched over to sex.
Also - you don't have to be an adult to read these boards. And while I would by no means classify Vegweb as even remotely sexually explicit - the fact is that you don't know who is reading this. Teachers - would you want your students coming across this stuff? Parents - your kids?
I wholly defend your right to your opinion, but your statement(s) instigate debate. I had to edit my response before I hit post because you purposefully didn't put this on the debate thread and then debate bait.
I wholly defend your right to your opinion, but your statement(s) instigate debate. I had to edit my response before I hit post because you purposefully didn't put this on the debate thread and then debate bait.
This is where I'm getting stuck as well. I mean, I totally think your opinion is valid, but you just kind of posted it and gave your rationale/opinions in depth and then said you weren't looking for a discussion. I don't really know how to act here other than to nod and say ok, since it's not *supposed* to be a debate. I'm sorry.
The piercing thread is a good example.
well, piercing sometimes involves genitalia. so yeah.....that might lead to sex talk
That was about piercings! Really, that had very little to do with sex. It was about body parts getting pierced. Mostly we talked about that piercing in relation to our exercise schedules.
I'm with you PP! :)
I often thought imagine if people's friends, coworkers, kids, parents or S.O's came across this site and read about themselves or everyone else!
To me, sex is a personal thing. Something shared between me and the person I am with. Talking to girlfriends or guy friends in real life is one thing. Telling details on a public forum is another.
For awhile it seemed like everything was about sex. For a newbie coming to the board for the first time, especially a young one, it may have been a turn off. Or a turn on! :) I wouldn't want an 12 year old reading some of the stuff.
Not to say it shouldn't be discussed on the board if one wants to discuss it. Does seem like a few threads were hijacked so so speak.
Just like in topics where it is NVR, maybe something should be in the subject line on sex topics, NVR.
Then again, that is just me. I read the threads mind you and thought my S.O. would die if he thought I was discussing our sex life on a public forum. Once again, that is just me.
I am sorry PP as it sounds like you have been through a tough and sad time.
Hugs
Di
I appreciate people making conscious efforts to not turn this into debate and am sorry if some of my statements came across like I wanted one. I considered putting it on the open letters thread, because that’s how I originally meant it, but I didn’t want it to get missed.
I also really appreciate some suggestions to keep discussion of sex to certain threads. This makes me feel like at least my opinion has been heard, which was my original intent in posting these thoughts. Just to be heard. I’m not gonna drag up old threads or be the new thread police. Many many times I have read something on vegweb written by a person with a different age, geographic location, political affiliation, gender, or life experience and it has caused me to think, “Oh. I never thought of it that way.” To me that’s a huge part of what these boards are about.
And how can anyone know that I feel this way unless I tell them? Like I said before, I have never heard anyone express the opposite viewpoint. I don’t want people to assume that its casual discussion is OK with everyone, either online or in real life. That's dangerous. It may be the minority viewpoint – but clearly its there. And if the only thing that happens because of it is that people are more conscious about the fact that sex may be a special topic for some along with a few of the reasons why, then hey. My work here is done.
Peace,
PP
I appreciate people making conscious efforts to not turn this into debate and am sorry if some of my statements came across like I wanted one.
Reflections coming from someone who already doesn't post about sex on here:
This is your one freebie to hide behind the Chit Chat board and suggest that people here have moral problems and are violating children and the trust of partners. I don't want you to assume that slinging crap and cowering behind a board is OK with everyone. Just so you know.
Really, I think this is being made into more than it is. As she said, PP just wanted to express her (important) opinion, which is WHAT WE DO. I don't think that always has to turn into a debate. She didn't want to debate it. Fine. I mean, at least she made a disclaimer so that we could be more conscious of not turning it into a debate. If anyone else wants to debate it, make a new thread. She has expressed her opinion, we can choose to think about it, or not, and we can choose to make a personal change, or not. I think that's really it. The end.
Yea, she's not exactly asking anyone to change their opinions... from what I understood of it...
she was just asking to be somewhat more aware when posting...
that's all.
I appreciate people making conscious efforts to not turn this into debate and am sorry if some of my statements came across like I wanted one.
Reflections coming from someone who already doesn't post about sex on here:
This is your one freebie to hide behind the Chit Chat board and suggest that people here have moral problems and are violating children and the trust of partners. I don't want you to assume that slinging crap and cowering behind a board is OK with everyone. Just so you know.
Your comment is rude and completely out of line. PP never once said or suggested that people on here have moral problems or violate children. The fact of the matter is there ARE children on here and some of the comments and threads are inappropriate. Case in point..."who needs the sexiest vegetarian?"...the link in that thread is a clear violation of forum rule number 2 which states that posts or links to pornographic material is prohibited. That link is giving kids easy access to material they shouldn't be viewing. And quite frankly I don't want to hear/see people talking about masturbating with vegetables and then have to view pictures of said vegetables afterword. If people want to do that, fine..that's their bag, but not everyone wants to know about it. I think having some common courtesies when posting is not a lot to ask.
PP's comments are no different than any number of other people on here not wanting certain topics/ behaviors related to food brought up because it might trigger eating disorders. Those people are in the minority but still their requests are respected. The same arguement can be given to them...don't read them.
I don't see why you think PP should have to debate her feelings or desires or it should have to go on a certain spot in the forum. She wasn't asking for debate...she was simply stating how she felt. If you really want to get technical, I think your last comment to PP was in violation of forum rule #1...about not flaming or posting with the intent to entice a flame in return. What gives you the right to decide that someone's statements are "slinging crap" and that they're "cowering" behind a board just because you don't like it or agree with it and tell them that's their "one freebie"?
This is a hard topic. Mainly because there are things expressly stated as "Not Debate" that beat at my head to contradict them and thus step into debate. Stating "Not Debate" repeatedly while posting these types of things doesn't stop the thread from becoming a debate, it simply means you are not willing to allow others to express their own opinions on the matter. Which is what HH was stating with her comment which was dead on in my eyes.
Stating "Please do not assume the whole of VegWeb is comfortable viewing sexually orientated threads." is fine. Stating "There’s another person involved, a human being with feelings that deserves dignity and respect." is telling us that anyone who has mentioned sex is disrespectful to the partner noted in the discussion. And that is what instigates debate.
My only other point other than "Everyone is entitled to their opinion" is simply this. If you think that the only thing you have to "give to another person that is uniquely theirs" you are limiting yourself. Uniquely yours? Emotions, thoughts, ideas, smiles, tears... and so on is ALL uniquely yours. Don't limit yourself or sell yourself or your partner short*.
*My apologies if that is debate, but I wanted my opinion to be noted.*
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