Omni Partners and Compromissing...
So DR asked me a very interesting question yesterday. To make a long story short basically the question came down to "If you had an omni partner who you were totally in love with, would you ever just once (even if I goes against your ethics) cook some meat for him as a gesture of love?"
To explain this question a little further he was asking me this because he said that in relationships people sometimes have to compromise and do things for each other. He gave me an example of him and his ex gf. Saying that she was a devoted Christian and he is atheist yet he still went to mass with her and participated in all Christian activities because he loved her and was willing to put his beliefs aside for her...
So basically my answer was no i wouldn't because I didn't see why I had to compromise my beliefs for him. But as I thought about it, wouldn't him being an omni mean that he would be compromising himself for me since he would probably be eating vegan most of the time? And wouldn't he probably be cooking vegan as well if he were cooking for both of us, knowing that I am vegan? So really he would be compromising more of himself for me?
What do you all think? I felt like this question required the vegweb opinions cause now I'm a little confused, not in my beliefs but I suppose on the whole compromising thing :-\...
i don't really think it's that big of a deal. like, my cooking the meat wouldn't be (in any way) supporting the meat industry. the person who purchased the meat would be supporting the industry. the meat industry doesn't know and doesn't care if a vegan cooks it!
i would do it and have done it. i haven't done it in a long time, but i don't really think it's that big of a compromise.
i've had to cook it for work before (i worked at a burrito place called moe's that was a lot like subway but with burritos) and i grew up as the only veg*n in a family of omnis. i was the oldest kid and babysat all of the time. my parents told me what to make for dinner and i made it. as long as i don't have to eat it, i don't think it's that big of a deal, morally.
with that being said... that doesn't mean that i don't think it's a big deal as in actually wanting to do it. i mean, i'm never jumping up and down & hoping to be first in line to be able to prepare a nice steak or something. i will generally feel really icky and try to get a way out of it (if possible). but at work, for example, that would have gotten me fired eventually.
it does gross me out a lot and certain ones bother me more than others. the smells of bacon and fish (especially tuna) literally make me ill... like, i feel nauseated and i feel like i'm going to faint.
but, for example, when my wife was still eating meat (she recently came over to the vegetarian side), she got really ill one time and her only request was a bowl of chicken noodle soup. i honestly don't think that the great vegan gods were going to send me to the great vegan hell for opening up a can of her favorite and requested soup and cooking it and then serving it to her.
great vegan gods, if i have misinterpreted you, then i apologize and repent my sins.
You cooking him meat would not come from love... it would come from obligation and fear that he wont be happy otherwise.
Bravo! :)
And welcome, Kathleen!
i actually disagree with that a lot. i have never prepared a non-veg*n dish because of fear that someone won't be happy with me. that is a gross overgeneralization and from someone who isn't on the side of "willing to cook meat" so cannot really say how that person feels or the reasons for why they may do it.
reasons i have done it:
babysitter of my siblings for my parents (i'm a vegetarian, they are not, they tell me what to make & i make it... they'd do it for me)
my job (if you say i should just get a different job, then please be willing to hire me since i have been actively searching for a different job for the last six months, at least)
someone simply requests it (if they'd do it for me, why not?)
...especially when that someone was unable to make food themselves (little kids, sick people, etc)
i don't think it's "unvegan" to touch meat. support of meat comes from purchasing it. after that, it doesn't really matter what happens to it, and you could go to the store and touch meat all day long and it still wouldn't support it until you actually purchased it.
i don't think it's "unvegan" to touch meat. support of meat comes from purchasing it. after that, it doesn't really matter what happens to it, and you could go to the store and touch meat all day long and it still wouldn't support it until you actually purchased it.
I agree with this. I work at a dog rescue and have to touch/prepare/serve many meaty dog meals. I don't think this is "unvegan" (especially since it's for rescued dogs). However, I think the original question is whether or not people find it reasonable for an omni partner to request (or demand, in the case of mean omni partners) that their vegan partner prepare meat for them. I would never do this because I think it's an inappropriate request (regardless of whether one thinks the act is vegan or not). And my partner would never, ever ask me to prepare meat for him because he knows how much I would hate it and he's a grown man and can cook his own damn meat if he so pleases (but luckily he no longer keeps meat in the house ;)b ).
I would never do this because I think it's an inappropriate request (regardless of whether one thinks the act is vegan or not). And my partner would never, ever ask me to prepare meat for him because he knows how much I would hate it and he's a grown man and can cook his own damn meat if he so pleases (but luckily he no longer keeps meat in the house ;)b ).
but what if your partner doesn't request it? one could make their partner an unveg*n dish out of love without their partner requesting it. i've done it before.
just a couple weeks ago i made mine mac & cheese (the dairy kind). she tells me i don't have to, as if i'm going to flip out if i have to touch cheese, but i really don't mind (i'm washable! ;)).
before she was open to trying anything that she considered to be "weird vegan food", she would make dinners for me with that "weird vegan food" all of the time. at the time, the idea of the "wvf" repulsed her but now she loves it just as i do.
she told me that other vegans she knew would go as far as to not enter a house that had meat being prepared or wouldn't hold a bag of food (fast food) or groceries that had meat in it on the ride home in the car. one of her friends wouldn't even eat out of dishes or cookware that had once had anything unvegan in them even though they had been washed. in my opinion, that's ridiculously too far.
those types of extremes can be read as being rude (acting as though the non vegs around you are disgusting or below you; which then makes a bad impression for that person regarding veg*ns), will get old fast, turns you into a hermit (you cannot go anywhere or trust anyone/thing!), and is exactly the reason why that particular vegan was eating a porkchop six months later.
I would never do this because I think it's an inappropriate request (regardless of whether one thinks the act is vegan or not). And my partner would never, ever ask me to prepare meat for him because he knows how much I would hate it and he's a grown man and can cook his own damn meat if he so pleases (but luckily he no longer keeps meat in the house ;)b ).
but what if your partner doesn't request it? one could make their partner an unveg*n dish out of love without their partner requesting it. i've done it before.
she told me that other vegans she knew would go as far as to not enter a house that had meat being prepared or wouldn't hold a bag of food (fast food) or groceries that had meat in it on the ride home in the car. one of her friends wouldn't even eat out of dishes or cookware that had once had anything unvegan in them even though they had been washed. in my opinion, that's ridiculously too far.
those types of extremes can be read as being rude (acting as though the non vegs around you are disgusting or below you; which then makes a bad impression for that person regarding veg*ns), will get old fast, turns you into a hermit (you cannot go anywhere or trust anyone/thing!), and is exactly the reason why that particular vegan was eating a porkchop six months later.
Preparing an omni dish "out of love" just doesn't make sense to me. Aren't there other ways to show love? I also can't understand why refusing to prepare a type of food that I find morally troubling is somehow rude. It would be like asking a Jewish person to prepare pork, or a Hindu individual to prepare beef (or any meat at all if they are veg and Hindu). How is this any different? I'm not "extreme" (your term) in that I don't refuse to use utensils that were used to prepare not veg*n things and I'll carry in my parents' meat-filled grocery bags from the car when I visit them (and subsequently enter their house to put said meat-filled groceries away and enjoy my parents' company). However, if someone refused to eat/prepare food in pans that previously were used to prepare meat, I don't think that is unreasonable (for example, strict Kosher followers have separate pans for different foods and refuse to eat foods that were prepared in the wrong pan). I also don't see how this parallels the preparing meat for a partner debate... ???
ETA: I think there are probably a lot of "extreme" veg*ns who won't soon be chowing down on pork chops.
My opinion still stands here. I am vegan because I believe it is categorically wrong to purchase meat or eat meat. I am not interested in perpetuating the message that it's OK sometimes, under certain circumstances and for certain people, to prepare meat. That's the type of action that makes people think vegans are hypocrites.
The notion that "I'll cook something for them because they'd cook something for me" doesn't hold water for me. My omni boyfriend cooking me dinner does not require him to compromise his values. But my doing the same for him does require I compromise mine. If someone wants to cook me a meal, I'd be happy to return the favor in some other way that does not involve meat or cheese. No problem.
I believe its about respect. My husband, LB, eats mostly vegan at home. He has been grilling steaks but he does it all himself. We do have dairy and meat in the fridge and freezer; creamer for his coffee, cheese and meat left by his parents. But typically the only non vegan thing in there is the creamer.
I do not like having meat in my house. Mainly because if it contaminates my food; either with dripping juices or improper handling by others, I will be the one ill for days. So yes, I am one of those crazy vegans that spazs out when something is brought in.
LB actually said not too long ago that he could be vegan. Our friend was like "Yeah, right." but seriously the man eats vegan at home and if I sent him a lunch he would be then as well. The food I cook, as he doesnt, is tasty, filling and healthy. When he wanted a 'mom made' dish I veganized it the best I could. He loves both now even though I never tasted the original version. So why try to replicate something familiar when you could interpret it vegan for your loved one?
Its a non argument for me really. LB respects me enough to not ask for meat for dinner. If he wants it he knows how to find a restaurant to get it.
I think it's all based in why you're veg*n, how strict you are about it, and why your omni partner makes the request.
I'm not vegan, but vegetarian. My veg*n-ness is not a moral stance. And, my partner is very supportive, considerate, and willing to respect my feelings on the matter - he would never make me feel forced or coerced to make something I didn't want to make.
I also respect that it's not my house, but our house, and he has as much right to have his choice of food in the house as I have to have my choice of food.
So, if I prepare something for him, it is out of love and respect on both sides. I am not feeling coerced or sacrificing my moral beliefs.
On the other hand, I haven't eaten meat in more than a dozen years, and as my dh says, my preparation of meat is like a blind person's painting - I have no idea what I am producing - and the results are very unpredictable (tho well intentioned, and occasionally good).
So, generally, he prepares his meat "side-dish" on the grill, and I do the rest of dinner, and more often than not, dinner is vegan.
But, I personally do like a live-and-let live approach in our house. It's what works best for us.
I was vegan when I met my husband, and he was omni, and sometimes I made meat for him even though I didn't eat it, and I didn't think it was a HUGE deal. Now he's vegan, so its not an issue anymore. Then, we lived with my parents for a while, so 2 omnis, and 3 vegans, and I woud occasionally make meat for them, especially my dad. He's a meat guy. And at one point my mom had cancer and during her treatment I cooked a lot of non-vegan things. For me its important to be a good example of a healthy, regular vegan, so other people will see that its doable. But its also totally up to the individual, and you will have it all figured out if it actually comes up. Trust it.
To answer the original question... no I would not make any compromises cooking meat etc. If my partner wouldn't respect my choices, there would be no relationship. To ask someone who is a veg for animal rights reasons to cook meat is asking too much, IMO.
Maybe you could make a meal where he could cook his own meat, then add it for himself? that may mean a bit of trouble, but neither of you would be compromising what you believe in. what you're gonna do about your kids, that's a challenge.... :-\
to answer the original post...
I could never ever cook with meat. Besides the obvious glaring fact that it goes entirely against my beliefs... it's somewhat difficult to cook something that you, yourself cannot taste test. But that isn't the biggest factor as I HAVE compromised and cooked him vegetarian meals using cheese in the past (I only did this for a short period of time and stopped because I just couldn't feel right about it anymore)
My boyfriend went vegetarian several months ago, and eats mostly vegan except he still can't fight his urges for ice cream. So I never really have to worry about it anymore.
But my philosophy is that, he knew what I believed in upon beginning this relationship so if he had any issue with me not "compromising" to suit his needs, then I would just call Bullsh*t on him. I never asked him to compromise and go veggie, he did it on his own after seeing Food Inc.
I don't know... if you're a vegan because of the animals and such, then I don't see how you could possibly compromise like that. But some people are not vegans for the cause, but rather for health and other reasons, and in that case I could maybe understand how it's possible to compromise a bit more.
Anyway he enjoys 100% vegan meals with me now and it's so easy, and so awesome. If he didn't like the vegan way though, then that's his own thing to deal with... I am his girlfriend, not his personal chef/mother, so he could take care of his own dietary needs if that were the case.
Just my two cents :)
I would never, ever, EVER cook meat for my fiancee.
He's trying out veganism for 6 months, at my insistance, just because I worry about his health. Also, after watching Food Inc, it's become a moral thing for me as well. I wouldn't care if after trying it out for a while he wanted to go back to eating some dairy, but right now with the budgeting and the fact that he doesn't know how to or want to cook anyway, it's a bit impossible to do both.
As per meat, though I'd never leave him over something so trivial, I'd certainly be bothered by it. I understand the whole freedom of choice thing, but watching him poison himself would make me sick to my stomach. There's always free-range meat too, but again, he can't cook (and I sure as hell wouldn't be making that), and also, it's very expensive. He doesn't mind living without meat, so that really isn't an issue for us, at least not right now, or even in the near future.
I feel kind of bad about pushing him to try out veganism, as he seems sort of bothered by not being able to have cheese and the snacks he likes (cheese puffs, cheesy garlic bread, etc). I'm doing my best to learn to make alternatives to what he likes(which is going well, actually), or at least find them in the grocery store. The latter is a pain, because of the extra expense and the fact that we're really tight on money, plus it's kind of hard for me to keep out of the stuff... potato chips for instance. Heh.
If he does choose to go back to eating dairy after the six or so months that he promised me, I'll certainly insist that it's at least organic and made humanely. Research and personal experience has shown me over and over though that a, we don't need dairy to survive; b, it's not the healthiest stuff in the world anyway-- the nutrients in milk weren't even made for the human body...; c, it's an extra expense... good cheese can cost a pretty penny, and paying for two different types of milk just seems silly to me; d, my body simply detests the stuff.
I just want to be sure that he at least has a decent amount of experience and information before he chooses. Given the circumstances, I think that's perfectly fair.
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