Ralph Nader!
Posted by angeln syrup on Sep 05, 2008 · Member since Apr 2008 · 431 posts
I just wanted to start this because everyone I talk to doesn't want to vote Nader, but also have no idea what he stands for... not meant as an argument. Just a resource. Sorry if it is a repost, but I didn't see anything...
http://www.votenader.org/issues/
Ralph Nader on Obama, McCain, and the issues...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GvMJwMR6k70&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xX4DCg4zt8U&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69oc1VXYA9M&feature=related
Fixed the links... stupid pasting error. BLAGH.
I tend to agree with Nader on the issues a lot more than any other candidate.
I also think he could do some great things for this country, if only people actually took him seriously. If we weren't so stuck on this whole two-party ticket deal, he would have a much better chance.
I would vote for him (again), even knowing he doesn't stand much of a chance, but this time my vote needs to be more proactive...that is, a vote against McCain isn't nearly as important as a vote FOR his primary (only) opponent. So...I don't agree with Obama on all things, but this race is too close to take any chances.
I have not yet heard or read anything from Nader that I have disagreed with.
Personally, I will be voting for Nader as I really disagree with a lot of things Obama supports (or says he does). As for the people who say I am wasting my vote... I think it is a waste of my vote to compromise for a candidate who will get a majority of the votes... if people would stop thinking this way, then Nader would actually stand a chance, because when people actually take the time to research, they end up actually agreeing with him more so than dem or rep candidates.
Deciding to vote for the candidate of your ultimate choice comes down to what state you live in, if keeping McCain/Palin out of office is a person's ultimate goal. California traditionally goes to the Democratic nominee, so it's easier for me to vote however I want. I'm not sure I'd feel that way if I lived in a swing state like Ohio.
yeah, I live in a state that typically votes republican, so a vote for Nadar in TN. is a vote for McCain.
i live in texas, i would like to vote for nader... but if for some freak reason obama is close to winning in this ridiculously republican state, then i want to be one of the people to push him to the win. and i'll be helping the image of texas by saying "not everyone here is gun toting, right wing conservative" i guess i'd be saying that by voting for obama or nader. but you get the idea.
yeah, I live in a state that typically votes republican, so a vote for Nadar in TN. is a vote for McCain.
Actually a vote for Nader is a.... uh, vote for Nader 8-)
yeah, I live in a state that typically votes republican, so a vote for Nadar in TN. is a vote for McCain.
Actually a vote for Nader is a.... uh, vote for Nader 8-)
But if there's absolutely, positively no freakin way in hell that he will win in that state, a vote that isn't for Barack Obama, pretty much is a vote for McCain.
yeah, I live in a state that typically votes republican, so a vote for Nadar in TN. is a vote for McCain.
Actually a vote for Nader is a.... uh, vote for Nader 8-)
But if there's absolutely, positively no freakin way in hell that he will win in that state, a vote that isn't for Barack Obama, pretty much is a vote for McCain.
Agreed.
Honestly, I wish SO much that more people would take Nader seriously, that more people would make informed decisions, that more people would look beyond two major candidates...but the reality is that, in this election at least, it's not going to happen.
I'm already afraid that I'll waste my vote if I register and vote here in Georgia, since I'm pretty sure it's leaning too far to the Right. I think my best bet will be to get an absentee ballot sent from where I'm already registered (Iowa) so that my vote doesn't simply drown in a sea of McCain supporters.
Although I don't entirely agree with it, this Nation is a two-party nation. Maybe some glorious day, that will be a part of the past. But for now, it's just how it is, and at the moment there's not a lot we can do to change it. My biggest worry is that we're going to have a repeat of the 2004 election. Ralph Nader got 12% of the votes. If those 12% had voted for Kerry, well, depending on electoral college vs. popular vote, the last 4 years could have been VERY different.
Although I don't entirely agree with it, this Nation is a two-party nation. Maybe some glorious day, that will be a part of the past. But for now, it's just how it is, and at the moment there's not a lot we can do to change it. My biggest worry is that we're going to have a repeat of the 2004 election. Ralph Nader got 12% of the votes. If those 12% had voted for Kerry, well, depending on electoral college vs. popular vote, the last 4 years could have been VERY different.
and the same goes for the 2000 election. Gore was soooooo close
Although I don't entirely agree with it, this Nation is a two-party nation. Maybe some glorious day, that will be a part of the past. But for now, it's just how it is, and at the moment there's not a lot we can do to change it. My biggest worry is that we're going to have a repeat of the 2004 election. Ralph Nader got 12% of the votes. If those 12% had voted for Kerry, well, depending on electoral college vs. popular vote, the last 4 years could have been VERY different.
and the same goes for the 2000 election. Gore was soooooo close
True, but I can't remember the exact %.
Although I don't entirely agree with it, this Nation is a two-party nation. Maybe some glorious day, that will be a part of the past. But for now, it's just how it is, and at the moment there's not a lot we can do to change it. My biggest worry is that we're going to have a repeat of the 2004 election. Ralph Nader got 12% of the votes. If those 12% had voted for Kerry, well, depending on electoral college vs. popular vote, the last 4 years could have been VERY different.
and the same goes for the 2000 election. Gore was soooooo close
True, but I can't remember the exact %.
Yeah, hopefully the votes will be counted fairly this time around. HOPEFULLY.
Want to bring your blood to a boil and weaken your faith in humanity?
Watch THIS or THIS...just as a reminder. in case you forgot.
I voted for Ralph Nader then and will again. I love a man who lives within his means, and lives his message. I saw him on Oprah when he was running before, and he talked about how he lived on $12,000 a year living in a walk up flat and did not own a car. He said he walked to work and that he was willing to balance the budget and make the govt live within its means. I was impressed at that time and helped circulate a petition this time to get him back on the ballot. Voting for Nader is not a wasted vote. It is using the only voice that you have. :)>>>
I voted for Ralph Nader then and will again. I love a man who lives within his means, and lives his message. I saw him on Oprah when he was running before, and he talked about how he lived on $12,000 a year living in a walk up flat and did not own a car. He said he walked to work and that he was willing to balance the budget and make the govt live within its means. I was impressed at that time and helped circulate a petition this time to get him back on the ballot. Voting for Nader is not a wasted vote. It is using the only voice that you have. :)>>>
That's very well put. He's incredibly realistic, intelligent, has (in my opinion) awesome plans for health care, fuel, environment, tax, and the way the government operates in general. And he's not a corporate sell out. He actually cares about what happens down to the community level. Kind of like Obama CLAIMS to, which Nader constantly points out.
Actually a vote for Nader is neither a vote for mccain or obama, whose name is chosen??... you could say that by not voting for mccain and voting for nader is a vote for obama... same thing. Maybe if people would stop thinking this way and vote for who they actually WANTED to be president, we might get a good president.
CW: I've heard that Georgia might vote Obama this year. Atlanta is full of young and/or unregistered black voters that could actually swing GA to a democratic state. I know it's crazy to even say that GA might vote Obama, but it actually might. According to CNN, GA is only leaning republican. There's a chance.
If it makes you feel good, vote for Nader. Since Nader will NOT be President, not sure what you are accomplishing, other than symbolic speech. If I say WTF, that is symbolic speech also. Keep in mind, if you write in Mickey Mouse or Jamie Lynn Spears or Rush Limbaugh as your Presidential vote, it will have exactly the same effect on the Presidential race as if you voted for Nader. You can't dispute this. For that matter, write in your own name. That way you will agree with everything your canidate does! ;D
Personally, I think Nader needs to end the ego trip. >:(
Mr.C is cranky tonight. (But happy my friend CW is on here tonight after the lousy news from Trader Joes she posted earlier today) ;)
You're not sure what I'm "accomplishing" be voting for Nader? What are you accomplishing by voting for whoever you are voting for? Is it about settling for someone you do not wish to win, but has a greater chance of winning? Is not the right to vote in order for me to express my choice on who I would like to run this country? I'm not trying to accomplish anything, I am simply voting for who I would like to be president and is best fit to be so, in my opinion.
Nader is ego tripping simply because he is running for president? Obviously he knows he's not going to win so I don't think it has much to do with ego...
Should only democrats and republicans be allowed to run for president then, and those that have the funds, access, and backing to have sufficient media coverage?
well put Mr. C!!!
I agree wholeheartedly.
Mr. C:
I understand, and do not take it personally.
Given that people like to say those who vote for Nader steal votes away from democrats (which is not true... many democrats voted republican in 2000 and 2004, including those I know personally), thusly cause republicans to win the election I would say I am still "accomplishing something by having a say in the outcome in your state." Though, I do not agree with the way that you look at it. Maybe if the majority of the population were actually educated and informed in regards to politics/candidates, and not blindly voting for someone simply because of their party affiliation we would have a fair voting process, and finally elect a president who will do some good, rather than "settling"for a lesser evil. How about letting Nader or other third party candidates (including Mickey Mouse if you wish) participate in debates?
If Obama is elected, he (as well as Hillary) does not talk about cutting the military budget, and in fact has been quoted to "bumping" it up but for defense purposes. Why do we need to maintain or increase our defense/military budget in order to only defend our country? Obama talks about slowly withdrawing troops and working simultaneously with Middle Eastern government, ultimately withdrawing by 2010. However, small numbers of troops will remain for counter-terrorist operations. If the taliban and al-queda are stronger than ever, what is the proposition to handle this properly, peacefully, and as passively as possible? I have not heard Obama give his opinion on this issue, that is the reason for it as a question.
Do I care about green issues? Yes, that is why I'm voting for a candidate who has been backed by the green party and has a better environmental/energy stance than Obama or McCain... and supports the use of industrial hemp as a renewable resource with important fuel, fiber, food, paper, energy and other uses. Religious views? Obama is just as religious as a republican, and does not support gay marriage because of such, which is a personal LIBERTY! Do I care about the supreme court, big brother and individual liberty? Who cares more about individual liberty and the common people down to the community level... Obama or Nader??? Who is taking more corporate money? Whose plan is it to crack down on corporate crime, corporate welfare, and corporate personhood? Who supports single-payer national health insurance?
Some articles on "Nader stole Gore's votes"
http://www.slate.com/id/2185614/
http://www.observer.com/2008/whos-afraid-ralph-nader#comments
Bush vs. Gore
http://www.uiowa.edu/~cyberlaw/writing/comsen05.html
I also want to add that not only democrats vote for Nader... and that many of Nader's voters would vote for a republican as a second choice to Nader. I do not feel those that vote for Nader are splitting the democratic party. Many of these voters are not democrats. I could care less if someone was communist, socialist, anarchist, democratic, libertarian, etc. I'm going to vote for whomever I feel is best suited for presidency.
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