Spite uniquely human?
Posted by and_it_spoke on Jul 18, 2007 · Member since Dec 2005 · 893 posts
And on the flipside, altruism may be uniquely human.
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn12273-spite-is-a-uniquely-human-emotion.html
Interesting read, and I'd like to see more research. As far as I'm concerned the only real difference between humans and nonhuman animals is the ability to consciously control the number of offspring we have.
Though defining our humanity through the sophistication of our emotions and emotional capacities is interesting. As long as we don't write off the same in nonhuman animals.
Hmmm. I think those researchers should meet my mom's cat. She is the most spiteful being I've ever met. I do think that same cat is capable of altruism, though. When my daughter was a baby, she was very fussy. Sometimes Maggi would get up from wherever she was lounging, go over to my baby, and gently nudge her and purr to try to calm her. This cat had never had kittens, and mom's house is pretty big. The cat could have easily went elsewhere for quiet.
I agree. Cats invented spite, humans observed and learned.
ITEM: I love cats. Perhaps that's where I learned my sharp tongued sense of humour...
I agree. Cats invented spite, humans observed and learned.
I <3 u! Best thing I've heard for a while!
And on the flipside, altruism may be uniquely human.
Interesting read, and I'd like to see more research. As far as I'm concerned the only real difference between humans and nonhuman animals is the ability to consciously control the number of offspring we have.
Seriously? Because I rather think my intelligence and ability to reason is a BIG difference between humans and animals. I haven't seen too many animals build cities, cure diseases, harness wind and solar energy, read, write, paint great works of art, create philosophies, ponder the meaning of life, and so on.
However, I agree with the other posters that cats can be VERY spiteful! I took my cat to the vet for a teeth cleaning once. She was so mad at me that, at night, while I was sleeping, she chewed through the cushion on my couch - in my favorite spot. She lost a whisker while doing it, but she chewed through. That's revenge and spite right there.
Further, she only does things for selfish gain. If she doesn't get treats from me, she won't ever cuddle. If I don't give her wnat she wants, I'm ignored. She's totally the one in control of this relationship, lol. ;)
I can't resist posting this...found it floating in cyberspace:
Guide Cats For The Blind, by Les Barker
The word 'futile' springs to mind,
Mission Impossible, yes that's the attempt to harness for mankind
the intelligence of cats.
You've made a basic error, now let me expound,
this master-servant thing's okay, but not THAT way round.
We don't do the faithful subject,
we don't do the daily grind,
you should never have attempted this -
guide cats for the blind.
Give kitty so much trust,
and we'll abuse the privilege.
You think you're going out?
You're opening the fridge.
You think I'm trying to help you?
I'm not serving man but mammon.
You think you've gained a faithful friend?
You've lost a plate of salmon.
I might lead you down the high street,
I'll be back when I have dined,
we get very, very hungry, being
guide cats for the blind.
It can't be very pleasant,
of this I've little doubt,
to have your head stuck in a cat flap,
whether facing in or out.
You could be here a day or two,
with half of you out in the rain,
I've got to go, I've things to do,
maybe I'll pass this way again.
A dog would go for help,
cats are not that way inclined,
cats have better things to do than being
guide cats for the blind.
Of some matters I am ignorant,
but this I know for certain,
the best place for a blind man isn't
halfway up a curtain.
And why do they have to be up
on a roof at 4 a.m.?
It's a perfect place for me,
but what's in it for them?
It was where I had to go, and he
just tags along behind,
I don't know why, only a fool would follow
guide cats for the blind.
I once met a man called Pavlov,
from time to time he rang a bell,
simple things make humans happy,
but I have to say that, well
I found it a disturbance, and,
poor chap, I think he knew it,
and soon he only rang his bell
when I wanted him to do it.
Did you ask for our assistance?
If you did, well we've declined,
here we are, an oxymoron -
guide cats for the blind.
Seriously? Because I rather think my intelligence and ability to reason is a BIG difference between humans and animals. I haven't seen too many animals build cities, cure diseases, harness wind and solar energy, read, write, paint great works of art, create philosophies, ponder the meaning of life, and so on.
I don't want to personally attack your post, but I could debunk a lot of the crap you just spewed there. Ants make underground cities, birds fly on the wind, lizards warm themselves for energy from the sun, animals leave their scent/scratch markings for other animals to "read", elephants paint, and how do YOU know whatt an animal thinks?
The point of my post here is that animals are sophisticated, and not too different from humans. Just because we can't communicate with them, or understand their means of communication, doesn't mean we don't do the same things.
I don't want to personally attack your post, but I could debunk a lot of the crap you just spewed there. Ants make underground cities, birds fly on the wind, lizards warm themselves for energy from the sun, animals leave their scent/scratch markings for other animals to "read", elephants paint, and how do YOU know whatt an animal thinks?
The point of my post here is that animals are sophisticated, and not too different from humans. Just because we can't communicate with them, or understand their means of communication, doesn't mean we don't do the same things.
Precisely. Thank you.
The ability to do certain things doesn't distinguish us (i.e. use tools, organize, communicate) but the advanced level at which we do it is unique. Which is why I find the "sophistication index" idea kind of intriguing. Also, the greatness of human achievements is very subjective. 'I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry' vs. termite mounds? Just a thought...
RE: Cats - Do not confuse spite for pure unadulterated EVIL!!!1!!one!
Researchers are discovering that mole tunnels and termite mounds and prairie dog "towns" are about as close to architecturally perfect in terms of ventilation, temp control, and structural solidity as you can get...we have so much to learn from the "lower" animals.
Let's not confuse instinct from intelligence. This type of building is hardwired into an animal's or insect's DNA. It's instinct. Same with birds - they fly because they were made to do so, biologically. They didn't build their wings, and figure out aerodynamics to do it. They just DID it, as they are built to.
Humans, on the other hand, are not like this. They lived in caves before they figured out how to build permanent shelters. They were nomadic before they figured out how to farm. They walked before they had cars. They drove before they had planes. And so on. As a species, we are ever moving forward in terms of technology, design, architecture, etc., precisely because of our ability to analyze and reason.
This intelligence or ability to analyze/reason is what sets humans apart from other animals.
When I see a bird figure out how to build a submarine, or when I see a monkey paint like Van Gogh or see an ant write like Dostoyevsky or see ANY species - besides humans - attempt to answer basic philosophy questions .... THEN I will be convinced that animals and humans share intelligence and the ability to analyze/reason.
Don't get me wrong, I love animals. I don't want to see any of them hurt or harmed by us. They have emotions, after all. I think they're fantastic and we CAN learn a lot from them. But, I don't believe they have our ability to think and reason and progress.
I don't know everything there is to know about animals. I'm working on my masters in biology right now and STILL have a a lot to learn. But, the one thing I never came across is definite proof that animals have our ability to reason and analyze. I'm not saying that's a bad thing. Just a difference.
Except of course cats. You just know those suckers are holding out on us. They've probably figured out the meaning of life, and won't tell us out of spite. I know my cat would fall into this category. ;)
I don't want to personally attack your post, but I could debunk a lot of the crap you just spewed there. Ants make underground cities, birds fly on the wind, lizards warm themselves for energy from the sun, animals leave their scent/scratch markings for other animals to "read", elephants paint, and how do YOU know whatt an animal thinks?
The point of my post here is that animals are sophisticated, and not too different from humans. Just because we can't communicate with them, or understand their means of communication, doesn't mean we don't do the same things.
Precisely. Thank you
The ability to do certain things doesn't distinguish us (i.e. use tools, organize, communicate) but the advanced level at which we do it is unique. Which is why I find the "sophistication index" idea kind of intriguing. Also, the greatness of human achievements is very subjective. 'I Now Pronounce You Chuck and Larry' vs. termite mounds? Just a thought...
RE: Cats - Do not confuse spite for pure unadulterated EVIL!!!1!!one!
The mention of ant and termite mounds gives me the chance to share a really cool pic. It wasn't so cool for the ants, I know, to have their home treated like this but you can't help but admire it.
OK, I'll admit I'm so tired my ears are ringing--loudly--but I can't figure out this pic. What is that "thing"? ???
OK, I'll admit I'm so tired my ears are ringing--loudly--but I can't figure out this pic. What is that "thing"? ???
Someone poured plaster or something down an ant or termite colony. The tubes are the underground "hallways" and the disc like structures are the underground rooms.