Circumcision???
So its not the Ball thread....but i have a serious question. I am so torn about whether or not to circumcise this little guy. I was convinced for a while that I was not going to, but today after talking to a different pediatrician, I felt like it would be ok if I did.
I know there is no medical reason to do it....I've researched it a bunch but I'm just not sure what's best for the boy~now and for his whole life. I don't want him to feel funny if he still has his foreskin, but on the other hand, it seems like such a pointless surgery (purely cosmetic) and that it would hurt!
It seems that there is a recent trend of NOT doing it, and in most parts of the world it is not customary....
I'd love to hear from both boys and girls on this topic, and share any experiences you have had with circed and non-circed penises. Do you prefer one type over the other?
I have (heard) sex is better with penises that are still intact (non-circed) for both the boy and the girl.....and in many ways I feel like its there for a reason (even heard that the foreskin secretes a lubricant)
What would you do???!!!
If you had a penis, would you want it circed or not???
(another reason I was hoping for a girl.....)
Yeah, I know there are different kinds of female genital mutilation, but I read somewhere (don't ask me where it was a while ago) that those were the most common kind. I just think this is worse than with males because the clitoris is removed or damaged and its sole purpose is for sexual pleasure. Men don't seem to lose any ability to enjoy sex when their foreskin is removed.
I guess it's just a matter of opinion as to whether its worse or not than with males and to me it seems much worse.
Yeah, I know there are different kinds of female genital mutilation, but I read somewhere (don't ask me where it was a while ago) that those were the most common kind. I just think this is worse than with males because the clitoris is removed or damaged and its sole purpose is for sexual pleasure. Men don't seem to lose any ability to enjoy sex when their foreskin is removed.
I guess it's just a matter of opinion as to whether its worse or not than with males and to me it seems much worse.
It is true that there are various degrees of FGM from symbolic pin pricks to total mutilation. So depending on the society the 'version' of FGM practiced could be more or less damaging but in much of the world ALL forms of FGM are illegal even the 'symbolic' ones. My feeling is that boys deserve the same consideration. Nothing is lost leaving the choice to the boy and the vast majority wouldn't choose it anyway.
as many of you know, i teach soc of gender courses. i put this reading in my reader for my fall class, and i think it fits in here.
The Tyranny of the Esthetic
http://www.ontheissuesmagazine.com/1998summer/su98coventry.php
it is a story written about female genital surgery and intersex children. i was debating about commenting on the "genital mutilation" m/f circ discussion but opted out.
I don't know if this fits into your curriculum but you might be interested in this article published in this article published late last year in Medical Anthropology Quarterly, it's an Australian publication I believe.
Its very thought provoking.
JC, This really got me thinking.....
I guess if I was circed at birth I would be used to whatever I had left, but then if I found out about it later I might be curious or angry as well, and there's no going back!
I feel bad for your bf right now!
Hopefully later on it will weed out the superficial girls for him (as many of you have said!)
I have been with both, and at first when I saw that an ex-boyfriend was uncircumcised, I was like "Woah! I've never seen THAT before!" I was surprised, but then I really didn't mind. It's as someone said... if a girl is going to leave based on that... well... he'd be better off.
It seems that not circumcising is becoming more common, so it may be that he wouldn't even need to worry about a girl being surprised.
Also, I mentioned this thread to my boyfriend because VegWeb makes me think of all sorts of things I normally wouldn't consider... like how I feel on the subject of circumcision. Well, he said "Am I circumcised?"
I was like "Uh... yes, dear." Then he went about doing his own research on it... and he seems almost upset that his penis was altered and he didn't even have any choice! He's still reading about foreskin now... and I think he feels a little jealous and like he missed out. So... maybe that will help you out right there.
I'm glad my post helped you out. I was hoping it would. After J's reaction to finding out he was basically "missing" a part of himself that he was born with and never even knowing about it, I'm really thinking if we ever have a son we won't do the circumcision thing. I would just hate to make that decision for a baby boy and have them grow up and say "Why did they do that to me?"
I say remove it. It is more hygienic since bathroom stalls don't provide any means of cleaning it (i've heard that being uncircumcised means you nead to clean under the forskin after peeing). Also, I think it is more "well accepted" visually by romantic partners later in life. If I'm mistaken or if "other factors" outweigh aesthetics I am interested to know. I'm biased though; heck I don't even like turtleneck shirts/sweaters (I think they were invented to hide hickies btw)
(i've heard that being uncircumcised means you nead to clean under the forskin after peeing).
I'm not sure if that's true. I've only ever heard of daily washing during your normal shower. ???
(i've heard that being uncircumcised means you nead to clean under the forskin after peeing).
I'm not sure if that's true. I've only ever heard of daily washing during your normal shower. ???
That sounds reasonable. As I've said, I really don't know much on the subject but I really cant help wondering if the interstitial area wouldn't be a possible reservoir for yeast or anaerobe colonization. Presumably daily upkeep would prevent that, but what if the poor little guy has sensitive skin or some other predisposing condition?
wouldn't TP work? women have a lot of skin "down there" and they use TP to dry off when they are done.
I'm sure it would, I was just observing that in public restroom, men are typically expected to pee in the urinals which don't supply tissue. It's not a huge deal for a guy to pee in a stall, but that behavior usually makes other guys assume someone is insecure or possibly even feminine. (Het males are raised in a culture that values acceptance in the het community)
I can't believe this is even being presented as a reason to cut off the most sensitive part of a baby's penis. :o
Let him make his own mind up when he's old enough. It's his body...
I can't believe this is even being presented as a reason to cut off the most sensitive part of a baby's penis. :o
Let him make his own mind up when he's old enough. It's his body...
Is it really the most sensitive part??? Maybe I am missing out on something...
I can't believe this is even being presented as a reason to cut off the most sensitive part of a baby's penis. :o
Let him make his own mind up when he's old enough. It's his body...
Is it really the most sensitive part??? Maybe I am missing out on something...
Umm, well yeah. It's not just there to protect the glans. The glans itself isn't actually all that sensitive by comparison. The inner foreskin (close to the rim) has way more nerve endings. If you're circumcised, the most sensitive part is likely to be the scar line, or the frenulum (which may or may not have been left after the operation).
I can't believe this is even being presented as a reason to cut off the most sensitive part of a baby's penis. :o
Let him make his own mind up when he's old enough. It's his body...
Is it really the most sensitive part??? Maybe I am missing out on something...
Umm, well yeah. It's not just there to protect the glans. The glans itself isn't actually all that sensitive by comparison. The inner foreskin (close to the rim) has way more nerve endings. If you're circumcised, the most sensitive part is likely to be the scar line, or the frenulum (which may or may not have been left after the operation).
Yeah, that sounds about right. Thanks
...You know, as an aside, I never ever thought I would be learning things about my penis on VegWeb ::)
My son was done and he never cried or anything. My nephew was not circumcized and he had several problems with UTI's. He actually was hospitalized when he was three for a severe one. During the stay, his mother discussed the surgery with the pediatric urologist. Dad, of course, was against it because he said that it would reduce his sensitivity. The urologist's reply to this was "How would you know?" In the end, they did it. Its been four years and there haven't been any more problems.
The USA is the only country where not being circumcised is regarded as the cause of UTI's, and circumcision is seen as the default cure.
1) circumcised boys get UTI's too.
2) girls get UTI's almost four times as often as boys, yet no-one considers cutting their foreskin off.
"How would you know" circumcision reduces sensitivity? Because you're cutting the most sensitive part off, that's why.
I suspect that you had a pediatric urologist from the "cut them all" camp. It's unlikely that any urologist outside the USA would even have considered circumcision. Elsewhere, circumcision is an absolute last resort. Only about 1 in 150 UK males are ever circumcised for a medical reason (and it's getting rarer). Are we supposed to cut the other 149 just in case?
Hey, mi66uk, are you male or female? just curious....
thanks for your input.
unless his foreskin is sealed shut or some crazy thing like that, we are going to leave it alone
thanks everyone!!! ;)b
The USA is the only country where not being circumcised is regarded as the cause of UTI's, and circumcision is seen as the default cure.
1) circumcised boys get UTI's too.
2) girls get UTI's almost four times as often as boys, yet no-one considers cutting their foreskin off.
"How would you know" circumcision reduces sensitivity? Because you're cutting the most sensitive part off, that's why.
I suspect that you had a pediatric urologist from the "cut them all" camp. It's unlikely that any urologist outside the USA would even have considered circumcision. Elsewhere, circumcision is an absolute last resort. Only about 1 in 150 UK males are ever circumcised for a medical reason (and it's getting rarer). Are we supposed to cut the other 149 just in case?
Hey, mi66uk, are you male or female? just curious....
thanks for your input.
unless his foreskin is sealed shut or some crazy thing like that, we are going to leave it alone
thanks everyone!!! ;)b
I'm male and not circumcised. I never used to be that bothered about circumcision either way, but I lived in Australia for a few years around the time that the medical organisations there were trying to stop it. The more I found out about it, the more it bothered me. It says a lot that almost every Australian male over 40 is circumcised, but "routine" circumcision is now *banned* in public hospitals there in every state but one. The people behind the change must mostly be circumcised themselves, or married to circumcised men. I have four Australian male cousins who are all circumcised. Between them and their sister, they have five boys, all of whom are intact.
Australia used to be a difficult place to be veggie btw. It's a lot easier now, but it seemed quite rare about 20 years ago. People just didn't seem to understand it. I heard a story about a couple who went to a barbecue in Queensland, and the people there said "we heard you were vegetarian, so we got some liver and bacon specially". ???
i know that there can be some boys who have forskins that are too "closed" at the end, which can lead to problems with UTIs and whatnot. but i don't think this is the general case. (i was reading that in as nature made him, which is about a boy who's penis is burned off in a blotched circ. the parents were doing it b/c the forskin was causing medical issues for the boys b/c they were too small in the opening or something)
That's a good book! I read it a few years ago. Otherwise, while I thought my sex education was well-developed, apparently I was wrong. As I was reading, I was trying to remember...had I actually experienced both? I'll be able to identify the next one I see though! ;D
Honestly if I had a penis I would like it to be my decision and not my mother's or father's decision. I think it is a barbaric and archaic ritual that has no place in evolved and educated human activities. My son is intact. He is 3 years old. My husband and I did the research and decided against it. Everyone in my family who is male is circumcised and I saw them go through excruciating pain healing from it. Everyone in my husband's family is as well. So, we took the leap to be different. My sister did research and kept her son's intact as well. It is a myth that uncircumcised males contact more STDs. For support and REAL, HONEST, FACTUAL answers to any of your questions there is a discussion board that is beyond compare here: http://www.mothering.com/discussions/forumdisplay.php?s=6d422c6269a0dbd07ec912e6b687fdbb&f=44
I honestly feel as passionate about keeping boys intact as I do about veganism. Very, very rarely would there ever be a true medical to have this done to a baby.
On the sex issue alone. Please let your son keep his equivalent to your clitoris hood. Because that is what the foreskin is, plus so much more than that.
Glad to hear you are keeping your son intact by the way!
i know that there can be some boys who have forskins that are too "closed" at the end, which can lead to problems with UTIs and whatnot. but i don't think this is the general case. (i was reading that in as nature made him, which is about a boy who's penis is burned off in a blotched circ. the parents were doing it b/c the forskin was causing medical issues for the boys b/c they were too small in the opening or something)
I've kept up with this thread...but hadn't had any input....until..I asked my husband what he thought about being circumcised. He said he didn't care either way (for him). He wasn't traumatized by being circumcised...and doesn't have an issue with it. BUT, we agree that we would not have our hypothetical son circumcised. He also talked about John C. (As Nature Made Him), and I've read a lot about him, also. We don't think there is ANY point to being circumcised..and it's definitely not natural.
i know that there can be some boys who have forskins that are too "closed" at the end, which can lead to problems with UTIs and whatnot. but i don't think this is the general case. (i was reading that in as nature made him, which is about a boy who's penis is burned off in a blotched circ. the parents were doing it b/c the forskin was causing medical issues for the boys b/c they were too small in the opening or something)
I've kept up with this thread...but hadn't had any input....until..I asked my husband what he thought about being circumcised. He said he didn't care either way (for him). He wasn't traumatized by being circumcised...and doesn't have an issue with it. BUT, we agree that we would not have our hypothetical son circumcised. He also talked about John C. (As Nature Made Him), and I've read a lot about him, also. We don't think there is ANY point to being circumcised..and it's definitely not natural.
That good to hear! ;)b This is exactly the correct attitude. Men shouldn't feel bad or traumatized that they were circumcised but at the same time should realize it isn't necessary and leaving a son intact is not asking for problems or an indictment of the decision their parents made. For years there have been a lot of folk myths regarding circumcision (mainly in North America) all most all of which are not true. For example
...It is more hygienic since bathroom stalls don't provide any means of cleaning it (i've heard that being uncircumcised means you nead to clean under the forskin after peeing). Also, I think it is more "well accepted" visually by romantic partners later in life. If I'm mistaken or if "other factors" outweigh aesthetics I am interested to know. I'm biased though; heck I don't even like turtleneck shirts/sweaters (I think they were invented to hide hickies btw)
This is false. I can assure you I have no problem using a urinal. You certainly don't have to clean under the foreskin after peeing. There have been times when I've gone days or weeks without good access to facilities (think back country backpacking) and I've never once had any problem. Or perhaps I can put it this way. Daily bathing, in the US, has only come about in say the last 100 years (perhaps fewer than that even). Circumcision only became common in North America in the last 50 - 60 years before that it was very uncommon and has never been common in most places outside North America. Yet in the time before plumbing we managed to get by. If the foreskin was such a liability (particularly with regard to something as common as urination) it wouldn't have evolved as it did.
i know that there can be some boys who have forskins that are too "closed" at the end, which can lead to problems with UTIs and whatnot. but i don't think this is the general case. (i was reading that in as nature made him, which is about a boy who's penis is burned off in a blotched circ. the parents were doing it b/c the forskin was causing medical issues for the boys b/c they were too small in the opening or something)
This is partially true. A relatively small percentage of boys can develop what is called Phimosis which is a narrowing of the opening of the foreskin making it difficult or impossible to retract the foreskin. All babies are born this way (congenital Phimosis) as they grow, the foreskin separates from the head of the penis and the opening widens to eventually allow retraction. About 50% of boys are at that point by 11. Nearly all by 15 or 16. For those that are unable to do this, there are numerous less invasive options to correct this problem such as betamethasone 0.05% cream though the vast majority wouldn't need this. Also in boys UTIs are usually the result of certain congenital abnormalities of the urinary tract.
Although the myths are pernicious, things are improving thanks in no small part to the information sharing going on in a place like this people can learn more and thus make more informed decisions. Good luck to the OP IIRC you're just days away be sure to check out some of the links I provided earlier. :)
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