You are here

Wrong to save a baby polar bear?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17703212/?GT1=9145

I found this story to be interesting.

gosh. i don't agree with it being wrong to save him.
humans and animals should be able to live in peace together, and that should involve helping each other out at times!

0 likes

that bear is too darn cute

killing a cub just because it's mother rejected it? what a horrible thought  :(

0 likes

but it's OK to keep a polar bear in captivity?

0 likes

I agree, put people in the zoo, not animals....oh yeah we have those "people zoos" where they keep humans in cages..they're called prison! I don't know what the animals were "sentenced" for, but I doubt they got a fair trial!  >:(

0 likes

This is kind of like those documentaries where they actually film a baby animal growing weak and dying because it got separated from the herd or it's mother got killed or whatever, and the voiceover (often Attenborough) tells the audience that they didn't intervene because "that's the way things are in nature." Never mind that there are about a dozen sentient beings equipped with trucks, water, and supposedly intelligence watching it happen, when they could do something to save the animal's life. And THEN they rabbit on about how whatever species it is, is on the endangered list or whatever. :(

0 likes

(i should preface this by saying that i have not clicked on the link at the beginning of this thread...)

i have to say that i agree with richard attenborough in that case.  he is usually observing animals in the wild.  wild animals do things by instinct, and there is a food chain that should be enforced and not tampered with.  if he were to intervene when a tiger wants to prey on a baby wildebeast, consider what would happen.  a tiger with no food.  you just can't step in.  often, when animals reject their offspring, it is for a reason.  the offspring may be diseased, retarded, or otherwise, which will make life difficult and possibly more dangerous for the others in the pack.  if he were to step in and save a baby animal whose mother rejected it, what would happen then?  after intervening, there is no way that the animal could ever return to the wild, which means living in captivity.  then, the people who run the place will have to kill the kind of animals that IT eats to keep it alive.  you just can't win.

we have to remember that whenever humans have tried to intervene in natural situations to "fix it", it has usually turned out for the worse. 

fiona

0 likes

I know, fiona, and you're right... but it just seems gratuituous to film it dying and then put it out there...I guess I'm a real weakling. :-[

0 likes

but a documentary or a news story has to have that quality of just observing and showing people what happens in the world--good or bad.  usually, it is to try to incite something in you, the reader or audience.  it pulls at your heartstrings, and that's why it made the news.  personally, unless they actually caused the situation with the intent of filming it for their own gain, i don't think it was gratuitous to show it.  if i were to watch it, i am sure i would tear up, so i am a bit of a weakling, too! :'(

fiona

0 likes

Perhaps these are the animals that should be in the zoos. If there is truth in that zoos bring awareness which stirs people to be more caring and helpful in the conservation of species, then the zoos should be the place for those who can't make it outside of one. Knowing that the animals they see are only there to see because they would otherwise be dead, may intensify the emotions visitors feel (?)  Captivity is not a good way of life, but if a child must stay in a hospital to live, we put him in the hospital, we don't just wait for him to die so he won't have to be stuck somewhere, and as was discussed above, if it were a child being killed, no one would just observe the death and then display it on T.V.  That would be too wrong--so why another helpless being? It is a part of nature, but so are we. . .why can't we help?

0 likes

Regardless of whether or not the zoo shouldn't have saved the polar bears life--they still did and the bear is alive/growing.  To kill it now would be sooo pointless.  What would they do, euthanize it?  How does that look for zoos around the world "Um...we euthanize healthy animals because some people say we need to"

0 likes

Captivity is not a good way of life, but if a child must stay in a hospital to live, we put him in the hospital, we don't just wait for him to die so he won't have to be stuck somewhere, and as was discussed above, if it were a child being killed, no one would just observe the death and then display it on T.V.  That would be too wrong--so why another helpless being? It is a part of nature, but so are we. . .why can't we help?

i agree with that, but you have to consider that you are talking about a child, and people in a hospital taking care of their own kind, which is natural.  it is natural for all animals, (including humans) to take care of their own kind.  if a human mother were to reject her baby, you can bet it is not because of instinct, it is for selfish reasons.  the polar bear was (probably) instinctively rejecting her offspring for an actual reason.  were there other polar bears who were willing to raise it as their own?  if so, i think that would be great, but if not...people stepping in will probably be to the detriment of the animal in other ways. 

i think if you are adamantly against captivity, you would leave the baby polar bear to die.  that is what naturally would've happened in the wild.  (euthanizing it would be more humane than letting it starve) why would we try to change what would naturally have happened?  do we think we know better what should happen to a baby animal than its own mother?  animal mothers eat their young all of the time, but we shouldn't try to do anything about it.  it is natural, and that is a good thing.  it is a balance.  if you try to change something, you lose the balance.  if there are too many polar bears, then the seals will be endangered.  a litter (?) of baby birds will often kill their smallest sibling so they each get more food and have a better chance of surviving.  should we step in and save that smallest baby bird?  my answer is "no", not even if it happens at the zoo. 

i know i may be alone on this, but i do put a higher value on human life, because i believe humans are spiritual and animals aren't.  i love animals.  i think they are wonderful and innocent and beautiful and awe-inspiring in their creation.  i love babies and children for the same reasons, but they fascinate me even more because of their spirit. 

fiona

0 likes

i know i may be alone on this, but i do put a higher value on human life, because i believe humans are spiritual and animals aren't.
(not sure if I copied and pasted right from last post)

I don't know about others out there but I do believe that animals are spiritual, I don't think they go to church or anyting  ;) but I think they are part of the master energy and light the flows through everything. Because I think animals are equal to us, they might not think like us but our brain is not what gives us our spirituality, its our soul. Thanks just what I believe.

0 likes

I believe that God never intended originally for us to eat animals.  I found this websurfing:

http://nazirene.org/essene_gospel_of_peace_book1.htm

"It was said to them of old time, 'Honor thy Heavenly Father and thy Earthly Mother, and do their commandments, that thy days may be long upon the earth.' And next afterward was given this commandment, 'Thou shalt not kill,' for life is given to all by God, and that which God has given, let not man take away. For-I tell you truly, from one Mother proceeds all that lives upon the earth. Therefore, he who kills, kills his brother. And from him will the Earthly Mother turn away, and will pluck from him her quickening breasts. And he will be shunned by her angels, and Satan will have his dwelling in his body. And the flesh of slain beasts in his body will become his own tomb. For I tell you truly, he who kills, kills himself, and whoso eats the flesh of slain beasts, eats of the body of death. For in his blood every drop of their blood turns to poison; in his breath their breath to stink; in his flesh their flesh to boils; in his bones their bones to chalk; in his bowels their bowels t o decay; in his eyes their eyes to scales; in his ears their ears to waxy issue. And their death will become his death. For only in the service of your Heavenly Father are your debts of seven years forgiven in seven clays. But Satan forgives you nothing and you must pay him for all. 'Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot; burning for burning, wound for wound; life for life, death for death.' For the wages of sin is death. Kill not, neither eat the flesh of your innocent prey, lest you become the slaves of Satan. For that is the path of sufferings, and it leads unto death. But do the will of God, that his angels may serve you on the way of life. Obey, therefore, the words of God: 'Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to everything that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is breath of life, I give every green herb for meat. Also the milk of every thing that moveth and liveth upon earth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given unto them, so I give their milk unto you. But flesh, and the blood which quickens it, shall ye not eat. And, surely, your spurting blood will I require, your blood wherein is your soul; I will require all slain beasts, and the souls of all slain men. For I the Lord thy God am a God strong and jealous, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me; and showing mercy unto thousands -of them that love me, and keep my commandments. Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength: this is the first and greatest commandment.' And the second is like unto it: 'Love thy neighbor as thyself' There is none other commandment greater than these."

0 likes

"A human is the only animal that thinks it's better than other animals"

I heard a quote similar to this somewhere

0 likes

The only problem with the "letting nature take its course" mentality is that, due to widespread human exploitation and destruction of the planet, nature no longer exists the way it did 200 years ago.

Unfortunately, the burning of fossil fuels by humans is heating up the planet at a rapid rate, quickly melting the polar ice caps and shrinking the polar bear's natural habitat.  As I understand the situation, many polar bears in the arctic are drowning because there isn't enough ice available for them to make their way across their hunting grounds.  They have to swim too far and they drown.  The last statistic I heard is that within 50 years or so, they will be near extinction if not already gone.

Hopefully, in another decade or two polar bear preservation programs will be in place.  At that time, they'll need a wide gene pool to help ensure the continuation of the species.  Maybe at that time, that little guy's semen can be used to artificially inseminate some female bear in the wild, therefore helping save the entire species.

I say don't kill him.  I like polar bears and I want them to continue to exist.  If he's useful later on it would be foolish to kill him now simply because he was rejected by his mother. 

0 likes

Thank you, CateS...that's sort of what I meant by my first post in this thread but I couldn't express it. These animals are already endangered, the little guy was born in the zoo, he's never lived "naturally"...well, you said it better than I could. Kudos.

0 likes

_

0 likes

"A human is the only animal that thinks it's better than other animals"

I heard a quote similar to this somewhere

no one knows what animals think.  what we DO know, is that there is a very structured system of heirarchy in the animal kingdom, which inevitably leads to superiors and inferiors.  an alpha male gorilla DOES think he is better and superior to the others, don't you think? 

fiona

0 likes

Hopefully, in another decade or two polar bear preservation programs will be in place.  At that time, they'll need a wide gene pool to help ensure the continuation of the species.  Maybe at that time, that little guy's semen can be used to artificially inseminate some female bear in the wild, therefore helping save the entire species.

do they artificially inseminate wild animals?  i know they often take wild semen samples to inseminate captive females, but the other way around?  you would assume that if they inseminate a wild female, they would want to control what happens to her, and mark her and mark the baby, etc....it would be hard not to domesticate that mother, adding to the captive population.  i guess it is just hard for me to see the usefulness of making more polar bears if the ones you make will be in captivity.  even if they are somehow still part of the ecosystem, won't their instincts be comprimised with all of the human support and care?

fiona

0 likes

i know i may be alone on this, but i do put a higher value on human life, because i believe humans are spiritual and animals aren't.  i love animals.  i think they are wonderful and innocent and beautiful and awe-inspiring in their creation.  i love babies and children for the same reasons, but they fascinate me even more because of their spirit. 

I said this once before on a post and I guess I feel the need to repeat it. I do not feel that my personal life is worth anymore than an animal's life. It is one of the main reasons why I am vegan. Maybe if those that think like that (think human life is worth more) actually stop thinking like that, the factory farms, canned hunts, circuses that use animals, and zoos that hold animals in prisons would go away. But I guess until those that take a "story book" literally as a structure for how to live their life exists, those very same things I mentioned above will continue to exist as well. Guess you can call me an "Angry Vegan".....

0 likes

Pages

Log in or register to post comments

More Posts Like This