Omni Partners and Compromissing...
So DR asked me a very interesting question yesterday. To make a long story short basically the question came down to "If you had an omni partner who you were totally in love with, would you ever just once (even if I goes against your ethics) cook some meat for him as a gesture of love?"
To explain this question a little further he was asking me this because he said that in relationships people sometimes have to compromise and do things for each other. He gave me an example of him and his ex gf. Saying that she was a devoted Christian and he is atheist yet he still went to mass with her and participated in all Christian activities because he loved her and was willing to put his beliefs aside for her...
So basically my answer was no i wouldn't because I didn't see why I had to compromise my beliefs for him. But as I thought about it, wouldn't him being an omni mean that he would be compromising himself for me since he would probably be eating vegan most of the time? And wouldn't he probably be cooking vegan as well if he were cooking for both of us, knowing that I am vegan? So really he would be compromising more of himself for me?
What do you all think? I felt like this question required the vegweb opinions cause now I'm a little confused, not in my beliefs but I suppose on the whole compromising thing :-\...
Well, the compromise that you would have to make cooking your DR meat is very different than the compromise he would have to make eating your vegan food. He thinks it's OK to eat any plant and animal foods, so eating vegan doesn't go against his beliefs. But, eating meat DOES go against yours. So it's not an equitable compromise anyway.
I'm not sure the church analogy is exactly on target either. The way I see it, an appropriate analogy to your eating meat sometimes would be his ex-gf compromising and, say, breaking a commandment (pick one) once in a while because her boyfriend is atheist. You wouldn't ask a Christian to compromise her beliefs in that way. But his attending church for her is more along the lines of, say, your going to a social function where meat is served but where you don't eat anything. See what I mean?
I would never ever cook meat for my boyfriend. If I felt pressured to do so, I shouldn't be with him anyway. A adult can cook his own food if he really wants it. Slaughter is not a gesture of love in my book.
It's an interesting discussion. My initial question would be, what is compromise? Are both "comprimises" in this situation equal? Yes, he would be compromising in that he doesn't normally make vegan meals and felt the need to accomodate for you, as would also be true if you prepared meat. However, you may feel preparing meat is overtly wrong, but him preparing vegan meals isn't so much a moral dilemma but an inconvenience.
I'm trying to see it from on omni perspective. The analogy of going to church for his ex seems relevant, but did he have any moral dilemma with going to church? Did he feel he was cheapening himself?
Certainly interesting, though. One reason I'd like to meet someone who didn't eat meat. Not that I wouldn't date someone who did, but it would certainly be convenient and wouldn't be an issue.
I think cooking meat is gross. I didn't do it even when I was omni. However, that said, my boyfriend is omni and I regularly cook his-and-her version of our meals - TVP sloppy joes for me, meat for him, etc. For me, since we live together, it's a question of knowing he doesn't eat any other forms of proteins (he'll deal with tofu, but not all the time, and doesn't eat many nuts, etc.), so I do it for his health. It's yucky, yeah, but he's making compromises for me by eating weird hippie food he usually doesn't even like six nights a week - as long as it's not going in my body and I'm not paying for it, I can add some beef to his half of the stir-fry on the seventh night.
However, everyone is different - my reasons for being vegan may be totally different from yours, and your partner may or may not be more accepting or compromising than mine.
(newb question - what's DR? I've seen people say it a lot)
My boyfriend and daughter are omni, my son has recently given up red meats and pork and his goal is eventually become 100% vegan. I have gotten to the point where I hate cooking meat, but I do it, making essentially two main courses for dinner. I do try to stick to a vegan dinner as often as I can, but I compromise as well because I figure that if I make yummy vegan dishes most of the time, my daughter and boyfriend will eventually get to the point where they don't miss meat.
I recently won a triumph in that there is no longer any red meat or pork in the house. My daughter has dear friends who own a pot belly pig and she can't bring herself to eating pork any longer. :-\
Now..if only they'd get a chicken and turkey too... hmmmm....
BTW DR = dear roommate.
It's great to see all your different point of views! I'm pretty grossed out by meat myself, so to picture myself ever cooking it again just makes me feel kinda uneasy, also I told DR that although I could never see myself cooking meat I did mention that I have not been in that situation...like blueheeler I'm not against dating a meat eater but It would be a heck of a lot easier if I ended up with a vegan so as to avoid situations like this...
I also told DR that it would be more of a compromise for me to have to put my ethics on the line as opposed to "potential omni partner" and I also mentioned that I would already be compromising since I would have to be ok with having animal products in the household as well as sharing utensils and such. But DR made a point of saying that "why does potential omni partner have to compromise his eating and cooking for you when you will never ever compromise your eating for him?"
Sooo, yeah this discussion lasted a while...also he asked me if I were ever to get pregnant whether I would eat vegan and I said "of course" then he asked me if the situation were reversed (I was a man and my partner was female) would I ask my partner to eat vegan during pregnancy and I said "we'd have to discuss it"...but then when I thought about it later and thought that that would be a bit hypocritical of me, to tell my partner I wanted them to eat vegan during pregnancy where if I were pregnant the discussion of me NOT eating vegan wouldn't even get past a "ummmm right you have no right to tell me what I'm going to eat.
tricky topic...I love hearing all your thoughts please keep going :)
but if someone starts dating me and is like "make me chicken" i would be like, go fuck off.
No shit! I would do this, too.
My BF is omni. We've lived together for 3+ years now, been vegan for 1, and our house only contains the following non-vegan food: raw meat for the cats, meaty cat food for the cats, and Organic Valley milk and cottage cheese. That's it. He eats whatever he wants when he's out of the house, though recently when he's with me he'll order fish or a veggie dish. He respects my choice and even though he himself wouldn't ever become 100% veg, he's happy to eat (mostly) vegan at home because he likes the food and knows that I really don't want non-vegan food in the house. Our compromise is buying him Organic Valley dairy products because from what I've read, they seem like a fairy humane dairy cooperative. I can't ever imagine cooking him a slab of cow flesh to "show my love" even though I know he likes steak. Wouldn't a nice cake or delicious brownies or something also be used as a "love" offering? I really don't get the "cooking meat as a compromise" thing if it's being demanded. Like Malevolence said, they have veg meals almost all week and she'll cook meat for him because he won't eat other protein sources. I mean, people still need to eat and get protein from somewhere and eating meat once a week still makes a difference in comparison to eating meat every day of the week. I think this is different from "I offer you this cow as a sign of my love" crap. I don't get that.
I'm with most people here.
If they require you to set aside your own beliefs to prove your love to them, it's clearly not a relationship which is functioning as it should. Going to church with someone because they're Catholic and do it - why bother? To me, the compromise there would be understanding her belief, supporting her right and desire to worship and not undermining that faith. Drive her to church, be respectful if she wants to pray at home and don't criticise her life choices, but don't demean her faith if you don't feel it yourself.
It's the same story with diet. If your partner wants to go to a steakhouse with their friends, don't judge them for it. In return, when you tell them you'll make a romantic meal and you serve up a lentil stew, they should be respectful and eat it. If it gets to the point where you can't live without stepping on each other toes and making demands to show your supposed love for them, it's gone beyond compromise.
My boyfriend is omni and I'm vegetarian. When I cook for him, it's always veggie and although he enjoys eating meat, our compromise is that I don't pester him on the ethics of consuming meat and in return, he doesn't belittle or criticise my choices. If either of us ended up demanded more from each other, we'd seriously have to consider whether we were right for each other in the long term.
Kennedy28, the pregnancy thing is a fascinating aspect of it! I sure as hell wouldn't go back to eating meat if I became pregnant, and my emphasis then would definitely change because I would want to prove that a vegetarian diet was the healthiest option for the child. My argument would be that if I'm growing the child inside my body, I will make the decision on how best to care for the two of us.
Doesn't it become even harder to debate when that child is born? I would want my children to have a cruelty-free, healthy, home-cooking veggie diet, but some people just can't get past the idea that you need meat to be healthy...
I'm not sure, but this is where I could see "compromising" occurring: Holidays, and sicknesses..... You know the SO's mom ALWAYS made a roast THIS way on Christmas, etc.... And if they're not used to spending holdays w/o the fam, it would mean a lot to them to try and replicate it. Same goes if they're really sick and they had a comfort food that they grew up with.... Otherwise, daily compromises....I agree w/ bp.... Even though I'm pescatarian, I've often been "playfully" ordered to go make "my man" some chicken! They knew they'd get smacked/told to fuck off, etc....but I'd also reply w/ something along the lines of "mmmm salmonella" ;D
I wrote a big thing and then lost it. To sum it up, it all depends on where your personal line is. I don't think that's something any of us can answer for you. Is preparing meat on the same level to you as cooking it? What about having it in your house? Obviously you would not choose to do it on your own accord, but if asked would you personally be okay with it? But, just as none of us can answer it for you, I don't think you have to adjust it for your SO if you do not feel comfortable.
...speaking as someone who does occasionally cook meat for DH (dear husband)
someone starts dating me and is like "make me chicken" i would be like, go fuck off.
:-D this made me laugh because I could so see myself doing this.
My husband and I have been together for 16yrs and I have been vegan for 2 of those yrs. In the beginning I would cook the meat portion of his meal, but now I can't remember the last time that I've cooked meat. There is some milk cheese in the frig for our homemade pizza, some seafood so he can mix it in his spaghetti and i think that is it. He's really good about not eating meat in the house and only eats it out. I wouldn't cook it as a gesture of love, but perhaps maybe if he is taking care of our daughter and is too busy to turn his chicken over or it'll burn kinda thing I would take care of it for him.
What I think DR meant was that knowing that my "potential omni partner" would be into meat and would like eating it for whatever reasons then would I ever be willing to surprise him with a meat dish just as my partner would one day want to surprise me with a tasty vegan dish...I think mainly DR brought this up because of his trying to understand me and my vegan ways...
I still stand by my "nay to cooking meat for said omni partner" but like many of you who are actually in omni/veg*n relationships I'm sure the situation differs a whole lot more than when not in that sort of relationship...
I agree though, if my partner where to say cook me meat and literally mean it, my response would be "uhhh yeah fuck off"...I agree Catski, there def has to be a respect for each others beliefs and belittling each other certainly won't help the relationship...with any beliefs in fact...
If they require you to set aside your own beliefs to prove your love to them, it's clearly not a relationship which is functioning as it should.
Duh.
I don't think I'd be in a relationship with someone who'd expect that, or even think it! If he knew me well enough, he'd know the answer to that question - actually, he'd know it's not even a question. I want a veg*n BF...
Besides, if I cooked meat I'd probably do it wrong and give anyone who ate the dish food poisoning.
My omni husband is very supportive of my veganness, and doesn't ask that I cook him meat. If he wants meat or cheese on whatever, he makes it. It's a personal choice that is wrong to be forcing on other people if they aren't ready for it. Since I've become vegan, he eats much less animal product than before and I consider that a "victory" (improvement) in the way we are living. That being said, I don't think meat is gross, most animals eat it and it's pretty natural to do so. The way humans go about getting it is pretty gross and wrong, but eating meat itself is really quite natural. I think it's wrong to be eating it because of the way it comes to our table, but to each their own, and I don't think I should be critical because we don't see eye to eye, I am in no position to be condescending.
My BF is omni. We've lived together for 3+ years now, been vegan for 1, and our house only contains the following non-vegan food: raw meat for the cats, meaty cat food for the cats, and Organic Valley milk and cottage cheese. That's it. He eats whatever he wants when he's out of the house, though recently when he's with me he'll order fish or a veggie dish.
That's how my DH started into veganism. Give it a few years of delicious food... :)>>>
Haha, yeah he's actually come a long way. He used to have lunch meat/cheese in the house and recently decided he wouldn't buy those anymore (which makes me happy in multiple ways, not the least of which is his health because lunch meats are some of the unhealthiest of meats). I guess he also has some Breyer's ice cream from time to time, but we're both hooked on the Purely Decadent made with coconut milk, so I think dairy ice cream might be out also ;)b
i was omni when i met my vegan bf, and he NEVER made ME meat. and i NEVER expected him to! besides the fact that i have never in my life cooked with meat, even when i was omni...it's gross! cooking times are confusing, it's slimey, ugh...
in fact, i started cooking vegan for him, before i even gave up dairy myself (gave up the meat before i was really cooking much anyway). i respected his beliefs, and he never tried to push them on me, but i just knew it would be out of the question to ask him to do something like that. especially when the food he made was so yummy anyway!
i dunno... if i ever ended up with an omni bf (not likely, since this one and i are dedicated for life), i could not cook the meat. he could go to wendy's or wherever it is they go to get their meat on the run.
My boyfriend of 8 years is an omni. He has never, & would never even think of asking me to make meat for him. The idea is laughable, really. Maybe I'm just really lucky, but I could not imagine someone who loved me asking me to do that. When we first moved in together, he would occasionally buy lunch meat. He has not done that in many years. Sometimes he would buy a fish fillet and grill it outside on tinfoil. He has not done that in a long time either. I don't know if he stopped because he knew it bothered me or if he just didn't want it anymore. He's come such a long way that he even chose the vegetarian option at the last wedding we went to. :)>>> We only cook vegetarian in our house - even for parties for our very non-vegetarian friends. So back to the original question - "If you had an omni partner who you were totally in love with, would you ever just once (even if I goes against your ethics) cook some meat for him as a gesture of love?" - I say, Nope, no freaken way! But, I would happily make him a delicious vegan chocolate cake. ;)b
I have an omni partner of 3 1/2 yrs who I do not cook meat for, and he does not cook meat at home. He enjoys eating meat, but he eats veg*n at home (we do buy lunchmeat for his sandwiches to bring to work, which I'm ok with because it means he ISN'T eating fast food and I can pack fruits/veggies in his lunch). He has never asked for meat at home. He respects my veg*nism and doesn't WANT me to cook meat for him because he knows that it is something that I am opposed to and uncomfortable with. From his perspective, he isn't morally opposed to eating veg*n, but I'm morally opposed to meat consumption. He is perfectly happy eating delicious homecooked vegan meals and defends his choice (and mine) to people who question his "manhood" or whatever for "allowing" his girlfriend to feed him a veg*n diet. He's even agreed that when we have children they will be raised veg*n until they're old enough to choose for themselves, and when we get married the reception will be veg*n. He was skeptical of these concepts at first, but in the end he came to the realization that veg*nism was something that's important to me and who I am, whereas he doesn't have any sort of conviction attached to his meat eating. (And I also think he learned more and more that veg*nism wasn't plates of iceburg lettuce and sprouts)
I do, however, cook more "substantial" meals than I would if I were just cooking for myself, and respect the fact that he doesn't like mushrooms or raw/large pieces of cooked tomatoes and prepare them on the side if I want them.
i agree with everyone's comments! my hubby eats meat when he is out but has learned that veg meals are yummy too and rarely ever has meat in the house. When he does, he handles it. it's just so gross - i want nothing to do with it and he respects that. It does take time.
my $.02:
Your b/f is figuring out the limits and you are right to stand up for yourself and let him know that this is something you don't feel you can compromise. The example he is giving you about a past relationship is a bit off as he is obviously no longer in that relationship... maybe this is a chance for him to see that a successful relationship isn't really about everyone giving up something, but more about respecting each others beliefs and life choices.
If you choose to not eat meat or touch it or cook it or serve it - than he should respect that as a sign of respecting you. Actions are a reflection of love, but only when they come from love. You cooking him meat would not come from love... it would come from obligation and fear that he wont be happy otherwise.
You cooking him meat would not come from love... it would come from obligation and fear that he wont be happy otherwise.
Bravo! :)
And welcome, Kathleen!
i agree with everyone's comments! my hubby eats meat when he is out but has learned that veg meals are yummy too and rarely ever has meat in the house. When he does, he handles it. it's just so gross - i want nothing to do with it and he respects that. It does take time.
my $.02:
Your b/f is figuring out the limits and you are right to stand up for yourself and let him know that this is something you don't feel you can compromise. The example he is giving you about a past relationship is a bit off as he is obviously no longer in that relationship... maybe this is a chance for him to see that a successful relationship isn't really about everyone giving up something, but more about respecting each others beliefs and life choices.
If you choose to not eat meat or touch it or cook it or serve it - than he should respect that as a sign of respecting you. Actions are a reflection of love, but only when they come from love. You cooking him meat would not come from love... it would come from obligation and fear that he wont be happy otherwise.
It's great that your hubby is so understanding! ;)b
This isn't my bf though its my house mate. I agree with you though if I don't want to touch meat for my ethical reasons then I should not feel like I have to...my house mates questions I think was more a hypothetical cause he wanted to see where my limits are. I think what he meant was cooking meat as a surprise dinner to show my love and gratitude for my "potential omni partner" which I told him I didn't agree that that would be a sign of love, gratitude or good compromise...
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