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vegan eating or vegan eating+lifestyle

Hello,
I think I'm doing the right thing putting this in the foodfight forum because it seems like it could be debateish.

Anyway, I am admittedly not too conscious of the non-food items I purchase, although I highly doubt the cheap crap I buy is made from animal hide, but I call myself vegan. I eat vegan and just saying "vegan" to someone is easier than saying " I don't eat meat, dairy, eggs, or anything that has animal product in it....including cookies and brownies...no not even with cereal. Nope not even fish. I do get prot---...." you get the idea. So I was just wondering if you guys are vegan and don't use any animal product at all anywhere, or if you're eating choices are vegan and is it for a certain reason or are you just more mindful about what goes into your body? For those of you that are vegan-vegan maybe there are some oft-overlooked things that are non-vegan that might be worth letting us eatingonlyvegans know about

i think with things like this it's a good opportunity to really think about what we need. i'm not making assumptions about what you use, i'm just giving examples:

do i really need to put on lotion? condition my hair? shampoo my hair? use perfume? use deoderant? clean my house with things other than baking soda and vinegar? use chapstick?... do you see where i'm going? i've slowly but surely reduced the amount of things i consume, period, while i've been vegan and now i only use shampoo very occasionally and bar soap just on my hairy bits (under-arms/pubes). i don't plan on replacing either when i run out. i also clean just with baking soda and vinegar. i do use vegan dish soap and vegan laundry detergent, but i know you can make your own laundry detergent and probably dish soap, too.

it's kinda like "oh i can't afford to buy vegan suagr/don't know what's vegan"... last time i checked sugar isn't a food we need to stay healthy as vegans. if your worried about it, don't eat it, if you aren't, fine, but your not quite vegan. do whatever is right for you.

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i think with things like this it's a good opportunity to really think about what we need. i'm not making assumptions about what you use, i'm just giving examples:

do i really need to put on lotion? condition my hair? shampoo my hair? use perfume? use deoderant? clean my house with things other than baking soda and vinegar? use chapstick?... do you see where i'm going? i've slowly but surely reduced the amount of things i consume, period, while i've been vegan and now i only use shampoo very occasionally and bar soap just on my hairy bits (under-arms/pubes). i don't plan on replacing either when i run out. i also clean just with baking soda and vinegar. i do use vegan dish soap and vegan laundry detergent, but i know you can make your own laundry detergent and probably dish soap, too.

it's kinda like "oh i can't afford to buy vegan suagr/don't know what's vegan"... last time i checked sugar isn't a food we need to stay healthy as vegans. if your worried about it, don't eat it, if you aren't, fine, but your not quite vegan. do whatever is right for you.

I'm really glad you brought this up. This is something I've started doing since I went vegan (and I just got some good ideas from you), and I'm a lot happier with fewer products around my house, and I am spending a lot less money on things. I decided I wanted to get a natural, vegan deodorant--but they are SO expensive. So, I decided to try the baking soda method, and I love it. Money saved. I clean my bathtub with baking soda and vinegar, clean my counters with vinegar. I don't use face wash anymore, just the bar soap I use for my body.

I recycle, but at one point I looked at my plastic recycling pile, and I was shocked. There was way too much packaging from products in there, and I knew I had to make that smaller. I don't know if cutting down on my consumption really has much to do with being "vegan," but I can't afford lots of those vegan products, just like I can't afford fancy vegan packaged foods, like vegan cookies or whatever. So, in both cases I make my own and I'm much happier with both scenarios.

Thanks, hespy, for always being that voice of reason!

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i think with things like this it's a good opportunity to really think about what we need. i'm not making assumptions about what you use, i'm just giving examples:

do i really need to condition my hair? shampoo my hair? use deodorant?  use chapstick?... . do whatever is right for you.

yes i need these things! i could not live with out them... especially chapstick!

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i used to think i needed chapstick until i realized that it just makes your lips not produce their own natural moisture. i feel much better w/o.

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What if you could use something that is all-natural, organic, AND beeswax free? Check these out:
http://www.hurrawbalm.com/

Neat product! Thanks for sharing.

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What if you could use something that is all-natural, organic, AND beeswax free? Check these out:
http://www.hurrawbalm.com/

Neat product! Thanks for sharing.

I think I just might order the almond flavor. Yummm.

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Now that Ive begun to post more responses to these "forums", im realizing how different I am from most vegans.
I think there are two types of vegans. To be exact, there are "vegans"- those whom believe in respecting animals and preserving lives of animals. I myself, "pure vegetarian", focus more on the health aspect to eating a plant based diet.
With that said, I do not judge people who live a true vegan lifestyle..I dont understand it, but I know some do not understand my lifestyle.
I went vegan primarily because I had many health problems growing up and throughout my years of eliminating animal products, I have found many of the previous conditions have discontinued.
I still wear leather, I use all types of lotions..and...dont gasp to quick..I eat HONEY. Lol.
I do not want anyone to typecast me as an environmentalist or an animal activist. The only concern I do have is of the fish diminishing. I used to only eat fish for protein ( primarily because I was served it fresh), however I have stopped due to the extension of manyfish etc Salmon.
I realize I dont have a lot in common with most vegans. I can mostly tell by my comments to these forums and how angry everyone gets. I kind of think its funny. Nonetheless...I believe everyone should respect others choice of eating habits and lifestyle.
It to me is the same as judging people based on whom they chose to date. I don't like being judged and disrespected. I have found that some vegans are harsh to meat eaters. I dont find that fair. If you are attemting to convince someone to live a better life, it is not effective to be rude and put down what they currently do as a tool to convince.
Thats all I have to say.

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Now that Ive begun to post more responses to these "forums", im realizing how different I am from most vegans.
I think there are two types of vegans. To be exact, there are "vegans"- those whom believe in respecting animals and preserving lives of animals. I myself, "pure vegetarian", focus more on the health aspect to eating a plant based diet.
With that said, I do not judge people who live a true vegan lifestyle..I dont understand it, but I know some do not understand my lifestyle.
I went vegan primarily because I had many health problems growing up and throughout my years of eliminating animal products, I have found many of the previous conditions have discontinued.
I still wear leather, I use all types of lotions..and...dont gasp to quick..I eat HONEY. Lol.
I do not want anyone to typecast me as an environmentalist or an animal activist. The only concern I do have is of the fish diminishing. I used to only eat fish for protein ( primarily because I was served it fresh), however I have stopped due to the extension of manyfish etc Salmon.
I realize I dont have a lot in common with most vegans. I can mostly tell by my comments to these forums and how angry everyone gets. I kind of think its funny. Nonetheless...I believe everyone should respect others choice of eating habits and lifestyle.
It to me is the same as judging people based on whom they chose to date. I don't like being judged and disrespected. I have found that some vegans are harsh to meat eaters. I dont find that fair. If you are attemting to convince someone to live a better life, it is not effective to be rude and put down what they currently do as a tool to convince.
Thats all I have to say.

I totally respect your opinion and think you have the right to live any way you'd like.  I also went vegan for health reasons, though I no longer wear leather and try not to buy anything containing animal products.  The fact is, I might not be the "most vegan" person out there but I am trying my best. 

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That's one thing I really like about these forums, is that for one idea (veg) to be behind it all, there are so many different views and ways of carrying out that idea...philosophy, whatever you want to call it. I have seen people get really angry when defending their lifestyle choices or opinions (not just about veganism of course) and I probably used to be one of them. I'm attempting a less critical, less perfectionistic, more 'let it roll of your back' kind of approach thanks to my amazingly easy going boyfriend. I'm vegan (or pure veg or plant based or whatevsies) for health reasons and I guess animal rights reasons too...sort of a hodgepodge of reasons. Wouldn't it be so silly to be angered by someone for being partly vegan? Even meat-eaters I believe are just doing what they think is best, and they're doing it on theyre on journey. It may not align with scientific research or us, but hey, if they decide to try some spicy cajun chickpeas instead of chicken then great!  :D

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I do not want anyone to typecast me as an environmentalist or an animal activist.

maybe you're the judgmental one?

I realize I dont have a lot in common with most vegans. I can mostly tell by my comments to these forums and how angry everyone gets. I kind of think its funny.

people on here are very pleasant and helpful  but when you start posting comments directed at other vegans that they should eat MEAT out of all things to get "enough protein" during pregnancy and people start commenting on your ridiculous post you get offended and think all of us are angry people LOL

Nonetheless...I believe everyone should respect others choice of eating habits and lifestyle. It to me is the same as judging people based on whom they chose to date. I don't like being judged and disrespected.

i don't believe you were being judged or disrespected in anyway... maybe you need to reevaluate your feelings and understanding of what was posted

I have found that some vegans are harsh to meat eaters. I dont find that fair. If you are attemting to convince someone to live a better life, it is not effective to be rude and put down what they currently do as a tool to convince.

i don't think these are effective tools to try to sway anyone towards veganism either and i don't think any of us on vegweb would do that... i think you missed something, somewhere

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Here's something I've noticed, and I'm wondering if you guys have, too, or if it's my mis-perception:

Do you think we veganish types argue with each other MORE online, than in real life? 'cause *everyone* I know in 3-D who's on some version of the veg-head path is totally relaxed and groovy about where individual choices diverge in the wood, so to speak... BUT: if you surf online blogs/ forums/ etc., there ARE some folks who get pretty... well, bossier than I think they'd be face to face.

In 'real life', I think veg*ns & their philosophical kin tend to be really kind, generous, non-judgmental, non-bossy folks (overall; of course all groups have outliers)... somehow it seems like that doesn't always carry over to online discourse -- I'm talking in general, not necessarily VW, just around the web...

My theory is that lots of folks (a) feel bolder online b/c of the anonymity; & (b) use internet formats to think through & hone their own positions, without the problems associated with debating ethics issues in person (damaged relationships, hurt feelings, etc.)... idk, does it seem that way to you? That's just my impression...

I WILL say, though, that I've been consistently pleased with how VWers can debate really emotional & controversial stuff (abortion, religion... even HONEY! lol) for ages and ages, with generally consistent civil/ respectful/ thoughtful discourse...maybe the 'judgment' referred to was in the poster's personal life, or on another site, or just a cumulative impression (rather than a direct response to a specific post here). I think a lot of folks here take pains to AVOID coming across that way... so maybe it was just a misunderstanding...? Hope so. Peace among us, I say! (even online!)

:)

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i agree that i am "bolder" online... i was just really annoyed the fact of how clueless "this person" was and about what "this person" said that would annoy so many... i mean claim "your vegan" for even health reasons only, but tell fellow vegans to eat meat during pregnancy for protein's sake is pretty obnoxious and uncalled for and then to act like we are all super mean because we reacted?!? WTF?!?

i mean i am no super vegan, but i would never dream of posting such idiotic things on a vegan forum

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... i mean claim "your vegan" for even health reasons only, but tell fellow vegans to eat meat during pregnancy for protein's sake is pretty obnoxious and uncalled for and then to act like we are all super mean because we reacted?!? WTF?!?

Yeeaaahhh... that IS a bit of a WTF, huh? I hadn't seen all relevant posts... interesting. That's... hard to support, I'd think, no matter why you eat plants in the first place.  ???

Chrissypoo, any thoughts? was it this topic that made you feel judged? or were you talking about just the 'in general' sort of mainstream-societal perception of veg*ns?

Don't you get tired of being asked 'but where do you get your protein?' why go along with this nonsense, in talking about pregnancy (tho I now realize this was another thread, sorry to mix-n-match!)? Protein needs are SO easily met with veg*n diets, it's surprising to hear this viewpoint from a fellow planteater... surely you can see how this would aggravate your (veg*n) readers, with whom this issue has been done absolutely to DEATH by uninformed omnis, ad nauseum?

For any discussion, consider your audience... most folks here aren't judgmental or mean at all, but you gotta know that if you post on a vegan forum about how veganism is sometimes not as cool as eating animals... well, what response is likely?! I'm sure we're more alike than different; but I think AML's point is valid...

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i agree that i am "bolder" online... i was just really annoyed the fact of how clueless "this person" was and about what "this person" said that would annoy so many... i mean claim "your vegan" for even health reasons only, but tell fellow vegans to eat meat during pregnancy for protein's sake is pretty obnoxious and uncalled for and then to act like we are all super mean because we reacted?!? WTF?!?

i mean i am no super vegan, but i would never dream of posting such idiotic things on a vegan forum

amymylove, im nowhere near clueless. Being vegan alone is very different from bearing a child for ONE. TWO.. I never said you or anyone were mean..you drew the wrong conclusion from that statement. THREE. I am open to what anyone eats and when I become pregnant I will do what I can to be healthy. Thats rational to ME. It may not be to you..thats fine. Maybe Im not a 'real vegan'. Who cares. FOUR..I will not raise my kids vegan. I would advise them how to eat healthy and let them decide for themselves. Like I said before..I dont fit in with "vegans" because obviously we dont see eye to eye on things.

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... i mean claim "your vegan" for even health reasons only, but tell fellow vegans to eat meat during pregnancy for protein's sake is pretty obnoxious and uncalled for and then to act like we are all super mean because we reacted?!? WTF?!?

Yeeaaahhh... that IS a bit of a WTF, huh? I hadn't seen all relevant posts... interesting. That's... hard to support, I'd think, no matter why you eat plants in the first place.  ???

Chrissypoo, any thoughts? was it this topic that made you feel judged? or were you talking about just the 'in general' sort of mainstream-societal perception of veg*ns?

Don't you get tired of being asked 'but where do you get your protein?' why go along with this nonsense, in talking about pregnancy (tho I now realize this was another thread, sorry to mix-n-match!)? Protein needs are SO easily met with veg*n diets, it's surprising to hear this viewpoint from a fellow planteater... surely you can see how this would aggravate your (veg*n) readers, with whom this issue has been done absolutely to DEATH by uninformed omnis, ad nauseum?

For any discussion, consider your audience... most folks here aren't judgmental or mean at all, but you gotta know that if you post on a vegan forum about how veganism is sometimes not as cool as eating animals... well, what response is likely?! I'm sure we're more alike than different; but I think AML's point is valid...

I believe that if you eat fish that is free range it is healthy. I personally like being vegan for now, however, I will probably begin to eat meat during my pregnancy. So.yea, I can see how you all are like "WTF".
The response I put was not in correlation with that post about cravings. that was just a general sum up of my ideas. Mainly deriving from people I know personally. I do not agree that vegans are not judgmental. I see many vegans putting others down for eating meat. I dont understand this. at all. I also dont understand getting so upset about a blog. I just dont get these things..anyways.. im done. Ive concluded my thoughts.

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Babies and small children don't decide what they want to eat. Their parents fed them.
If you like the taste of fish and you want to eat it, fine, but please don't just state that it's healthy and infer that somehow a mother would be healthier if she ate it during pregnancy because there is nothing to back that up. Just because you can ingest it and there are some healthy components don't negate the unhealthy aspects of fish (fat and cholesterol and mercury).

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Point taken.

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The response I put was not in correlation with that post about cravings. that was just a general sum up of my ideas. Mainly deriving from people I know personally. I do not agree that vegans are not judgmental. I see many vegans putting others down for eating meat. I dont understand this. at all. I also dont understand getting so upset about a blog. I just dont get these things..anyways.. im done. Ive concluded my thoughts.

Thanks for sharing your viewpoint; I think it would be a less interesting discussion forum if everyone was on the same page about everything... I think sometimes people get emotionally involved because these are ethical issues that are personally important & highly valued; and also, in a mostly non-vegan world, the sense of community on vegan sites is valuable. So, perceived cavalier-ness or disrespect towards that community can easily trigger negative feelings, even if that wasn't anyone's intent.

It makes me sad that you know veg*ns who make you feel judged or put down...  I guess (like with religion or child rearing!) most people think they're right about their own approach to eating (or else they'd change their position, right?!), and it's easy to come across that way unintentionally -- something to be careful to avoid, as we've discussed, since it has the effect of pushing people AWAY from the ideas we'd like to share...

Luckily, people don't have to agree on everything, for the discussion to be worthwhile! Humans are diverse; such is our nature.

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Okay, I have to ask, just exactly what is "free range" fish? During ecology and environmental systems classes we talked about fish farming and its effect on the environment, and not once did I hear the words "free range." Is that supposed to mean wild? And does this subset of wild include fish that have come into contact with farmed fish, such as salmon in Washington? Wild fish are transmitted sea lice from farmed fish, wild fish swim in the same polluted oceans/rivers/streams/lakes as farmed fish. Am I missing what "free range" fish means and how it is healthier?

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