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Polyamory

So as to not take over the other thread.

I do have emotional relationships.  If something happened and I or my partner wasn't able to have sex, I could work around that.  If our emotional/intellectual relationship diminished, it'd be over.  For me, the "connection" is the most important thing.  Sex is important to me, but it isn't defining - although bad sex will end a budding relationship.  I can usually tell by kissing styles.  I tend to work on the "connection" with people who I think will be good sex partners, so it goes hand-in-hand.  In a relationship, for me, what makes us "us" is the overall bond.

I avoid casual sex.  There's a high probability of first-time sex being bad because partners aren't in tune with what the other person likes.  I'm likely to be sexually monogamous, because for sex to be good (for me) it takes a few times with the same person and that wanders into emotional monogamy space.  However, I don't feel necessarily tied to either casual sex or monogamy.  

I dunno why I don't have a problem with open-ish relationships.  If people continue this dicussion, it may help me put it in words.  

I came up with that example after reading the polyamory site.

Polyamory means "loving more than one".  This love may be sexual, emotional, spiritual, or any combination thereof, according to the desires and agreements of the individuals involved

I was trying to come up with an example of the different types of polyamorous love.  I think we can check off emotional polyamory, though.  We're all in agreement on it.  I'm not sure what spiritual monogamy or polyamory entails, so I couldn't come up with an example for that one.

Polyfidelity reminds me of overlapping serial monogamy.  Polyfidelity: Relationship involving more than two people who have made a commitment to keep the sexual activity within the group and not have outside partners.

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Yeah, I don't know what spiritual love is either.  It sounds kind of New Age-y to me.

I read the FAQ on the site, and it still prompted more questions than answers.  I feel like every question posed is answered by a "Well, why not?" which is frustrating to me.  That, and there are so many definitions.  

I also came away from the site feeling that I reject the notion that some people are inherently "poly."   I think people choose poly or monogamous arrangements after weighing whatever costs/benefits there are.  That's really the only reaction I had after reading it all.

eta:  I'm gonna listen to the "Polyamory Weekly" podcast tonight for research purposes.  ;)b

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For the record: I won't be your entertainment, so I removed my posts.

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whoa, i missed a bunch of stuff because mm deleted her posts.  darn work getting in the way of vegweb debates!

kmk, i think what hh was trying to say is that people are able to expand on their love infinitely in many types of situations and in different forms of love.  you can love family, friends, and romantic partners endlessly without running out. 

i do feel that i am naturally poly.  i don't think i chose it, much like i didn't choose love-related things in general such as being gay.  i just "am".  i practice physical monogamy when necessary, but as far as my emotions, i cannot really stop them.  i can change situations so that maybe i won't be around people i feel are a risk, but that seems... i don't know... not right.  like if i know i'm going to develop feelings for someone if i'm around them, then why would i want to stop that?  that almost seems dishonest to me.  it's like putting your head in the sand to hide away from it or something.

so i would have to disagree with people not being "inherently poly".  if you are not one of "them" then it might be hard to understand.  but to me, that feels like when people say that my orientation was a choice simply because it's not how they feel and they don't understand it.  as one of my former coworkers stated to me, he didn't believe that my soul was gay because your soul is "right" and he didn't understand why i was interested in women.  i said, "i'm probably interested in them for the same reasons you are" and his reaction was, "but i'm with them for the RIGHT reasons".  oooooh, i had to walk away after that to keep it from going further.

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For the record: I won't be your entertainment, so I removed my posts.

Slightly off topic here but Moonkeymama, if you would like to inspire more debate on a subject please do so politely, with as much care given to your typed opinion as possible (as its hard to read nuances that are more obvious in a physical discussion), and stand behind your post.  That means not deleting them should the conversation not go as planned.  All the discussion you created now is floundering because there is no supporting first post that brought it into discussion.  This doesnt help as people will not be able to add much to the topic with it being so disjointed.

No one was using you for "their entertainment" they were simply discussing your post.

And people, just because someone uses personal attacks does NOT allow everyone else to use them.  I really dislike seeing them in debates.  It just lowers the whole value of the conversation entirely.  Even if someone else started it.

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I think Cali just posted because she knew I was typing about her.  ;)

kmk, i think what hh was trying to say is that people are able to expand on their love infinitely in many types of situations and in different forms of love.  you can love family, friends, and romantic partners endlessly without running out.

Thanks for the save.  I'm back on track.  I forgot why I thought of that example.  Cali was saying how a closed multiple partnership sounded ideal.  I was thinking of that when I thought of a non-sexual love analogy.  And then I forgot the context of why I thought about it.  I think my point was that I assume that it works the same way for sexual relationships, because the people who are geared toward monogamy "get" casual sex, but don't understand why someone would want to sleep with someone once that person is in a relationship.  I know that there are lots of different kinds of open relationships, but in Cali's case, it reminded me of how people can expand their love to include more than one person.  Love for parents is a bond equal to, or stronger (looking at the break up/divorce rate), with/than love for a relationship partner.  So, to understand loving extra parents is like understanding loving extra partners.

I'd still prefer casual sex to a closed multiple partnership if I was in an open relationship.

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For the record: I won't be your entertainment, so I removed my posts.

No one was using you for "their entertainment" they were simply discussing your post.

i think she was referring to kmk's entertainment quote

Oh my.

Ten paragraphs of vitriol is a bit much, but I'm entertained. 

in response to:

whoa, i missed a bunch of stuff because mm deleted her posts.  darn work getting in the way of vegweb debates!

kmk, i think what hh was trying to say is that people are able to expand on their love infinitely in many types of situations and in different forms of love.  you can love family, friends, and romantic partners endlessly without running out. 

i do feel that i am naturally poly.  i don't think i chose it, much like i didn't choose love-related things in general such as being gay.  i just "am".  i practice physical monogamy when necessary, but as far as my emotions, i cannot really stop them.  i can change situations so that maybe i won't be around people i feel are a risk, but that seems... i don't know... not right.  like if i know i'm going to develop feelings for someone if i'm around them, then why would i want to stop that?  that almost seems dishonest to me.  it's like putting your head in the sand to hide away from it or something.

so i would have to disagree with people not being "inherently poly".  if you are not one of "them" then it might be hard to understand.  but to me, that feels like when people say that my orientation was a choice simply because it's not how they feel and they don't understand it.  as one of my former coworkers stated to me, he didn't believe that my soul was gay because your soul is "right" and he didn't understand why i was interested in women.  i said, "i'm probably interested in them for the same reasons you are" and his reaction was, "but i'm with them for the RIGHT reasons".  oooooh, i had to walk away after that to keep it from going further.

i also feel naturally poly.  before i knew what poly was i just thought i was being a total dick, but after reading about it i realized that it's ok to love many people at one time but that one MUST be open about it.  and that if you are not being open about it, then you're just being a dick, and its not polyamory, its just cheating.  unfortunately i still feel poly even though i am dating a monogamous boy, and to hold in all of my feelings for other people that i've met along the years has been really difficult and sometimes unsuccessful.  my emotions get in the way and i simply dont see things from my boys perspective.  i cant fathom being jealous.  he's told me about other girls that he's met that he thinks are cute and i encourage him to date them as well, but he wont have it, he says hes a one girl kind of guy.  and i'm a many people kind of girl.  i'm still unsure about how i should handle it because i still have feelings for other people.

i really like this quote rb "like if i know i'm going to develop feelings for someone if i'm around them, then why would i want to stop that?  that almost seems dishonest to me. "

"i only love you" will always be a lie.  which i think is a shame.  and i keep waiting for the day that i truly only love michael. because then things will be easier.

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Oh my.

Ten paragraphs of vitriol is a bit much, but I'm entertained. 

that's why i removed my posts.  because of this girl.  because i was obviously upset and she (and a couple others) chose to continue making me a joke.  Why?  Well, I'm not a human behind this screen, right?

i couldn't care less if the conversation is "floundering" because all anyone wants to do is come to this thread and find out the "drama" and perhaps tell me a piece of their mind about how I should phrase and type out my posts instead of taking a fucking joke like it was intended in the first place.  you people are fucking exhausting.

don't worry about me posting in this forum.

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I know it doesn't make it right, but you slung the insults first, with something about "popular people" and people being mean and humorless.  You can't expect to get respect without giving it.  Also, if you write things to the effect of "I don't care if people get offended," and then they do, you shouldn't be surprised.  It's not as if I came in here unprovoked and made a joke.  I regret taking the discussion off track, but I really can't be apologetic for disrespecting someone who disrespected me first.  If you can't take it, then don't dish it out.

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mm,

I think we all know there is a human behind the screen, some are just letting their senses of humor out. Since it was obvious you didn't care about/wanting to be(ing) offensive to them, why should they restrict themselves of the same freedom you assumed?

eta, I was writing this at the same time as  kmk

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stop wasting your time in this thread, everyone.  you don't really know what the story is, nor do I want you to, which is why i removed my posts.  people read what they want to read.  too many busybodies.

hanashi: wanting to be offensive?  i don't know where you get that, but please, just drop it already.  i don't even know why you're poking your nose into a moot point.

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Regarding the topic at hand, I still am not sure.  I just feel like polyamorous people are more attuned to their feelings for other people outside the relationship--but I think everyone has those feelings, including monogamous people.  I know I've been in relationships where I had spurts of crush-like feelings for other people, but they really didn't matter that much.  It's just like, if I acted on every feeling of attraction I had for every other person (like you say, for honesty's sake), then I would have a whole heck of a lot of partners!  It doesn't really make me sad to know that there are some people out there who I have attractions to who I'm never going to have a relationship.  It's just all too much!  Lots of people are attractive! (by looks or personality)

I listened to some other woman's polyamory podcast last night.  It was verrrrry New Age-y, I almost couldn't listen to it, but the basic idea was to "let energy flow" where it wants to flow.  Meaning, like you say, if you have a feeling, let it carry through.  I just feel like, since when is that a rule of thumb for life?  If I acted on every emotional urge I had, I'd weigh three hundred pounds and have a celebrity-caliber wardrobe.  We can't act on every emotion we have.  Anyway, that's where the woman kind of lost me (in terms of understanding).  Not that she is representative of any larger group, but it does relate to what we are talking about.

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hanashi: wanting to be offensive?  i don't know where you get that, but please, just drop it already.  i don't even know why you're poking your nose into a moot point.

Are you even serious?
I remember your post.  It said, "If you are offended, good."  Or something to that effect.

Honestly, can we please move on?  Or are you determined now to bring the conversation off track permanently?  It would seem so.

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*sigh*  I was expecting to come back to more POLYAMORY posts.

mm, in your multitude of posts, you have yet to discuss polyamory except in your "joke" post.  We get that you're unhappy.  You stated that your intent with the first post was to get people talking.  We are talking - about polymaory - and I still invite you to discuss your views on how polyamory is primarily responsible for the spread of STDs.

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sorry, hh, i lost the desire to debate with anyone here.  my orig. post was up for awhile if anyone chose to talk about it, but no one did, you know what happened instead.

thanks for being so polite and inviting me too, though.  I appreciate that.  I would stop posting in this thread but I am unable to PM.  This is the last off-topic post from me, I apologize for hijacking the thread.

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I love all of you.  :)>>>  :flower:

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For the record: I won't be your entertainment, so I removed my posts.

No one was using you for "their entertainment" they were simply discussing your post.

i think she was referring to kmk's entertainment quote

Oh my.

Ten paragraphs of vitriol is a bit much, but I'm entertained. 

Ahhh! Thanks Kelsi.  I skimmed and assumed that she had meant the 10 pages of this thread.  That makes more sense.

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I have tried to read (skim) most of the thread, while portions have been deleted, I notice them term intimacy was only used once by Tino. And I wonder why.

After a handful of brief relationships, a seven year monogamous (by definition) and failing at things miserably these days. I still have not yet defined, for myself what love is, what it encompasses, although I would be confident in stating I dont think I would become involved in a polyamorous relationship. For me it seems to adds a complexity to a already complex bond between two individuals.

Thanks to all for the time and thought.

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I have tried to read (skim) most of the thread, while portions have been deleted, I notice them term intimacy was only used once by Tino. And I wonder why.

After a handful of brief relationships, a seven year monogamous (by definition) and failing at things miserably these days. I still have not yet defined, for myself what love is, what it encompasses, although I would be confident in stating I dont think I would become involved in a polyamorous relationship. For me it seems to adds a complexity to a already complex bond between two individuals.

Thanks to all for the time and thought.

Said essentially what I had to say, and I feel the same.

While I think polyamory works great for some people and I don't care if it's what they want - I hope no one ever expects this sort of relationship from me.
I am still trying to figure out "love" and I've ruined far too many relationships trying to figure it out (asking questions and coming off judgmental).

This whole thread makes me think of Brave New World.

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sometimes i wish i could be monogamous.  it would in fact make things less complicated since i live in a mostly monogamous world. 

(world being the place around me, not the planet earth)

being polyamorous in a monogamous relationship can cause a great deal of frustration on the poly person's part.  frustration, guilt, and sometimes resentment.

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