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Dumb Question

Dumb question:  Since becoming vegan tends to cause weight loss, why doesn't the pro-vegan portion of our population concentrate their efforts on the people like those in the following documentary?  It is a potential multi-billion dollar market, for you business  types out there, if you can do such in a nutritionally sound and complete manner (please see my posts regarding lysine and other nutrients missing from most vegan diets).

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=1673240771

I know I lost 1/3 of my body weight within three months each time I went vegan (probably because vegan diets tend to be so low in fat).  If this was to be applied to people like those in the documentary, we might save American from collapsing under its own weight, so to speak.

"We used to play for silver, now we play for life"
-- Jack Straw (as in Straw Man Specifications), Grateful Dead

hespy is a dietician. girl knows what's up.

assuming a diet is inadequate because it's more on the fringe is pretty narrow-minded for someone who is both a vegan and interested in the minutiae of nutrition. She gave a good example of a nutritionally complete diet, and it happened to be raw. The break down's there.

If you don't respond well to such evidence like that, or to counter evidence, and can't seem to back up your expertise with anything other than interest in the subject, it seems that your opinion is only better because it's yours. Which isn't very scientific, at all.

To add what Tweety stated, even with careful measurement, a person's got to be skeptical of nutritional info to be found anywhere. There are different values measured for the same foods all the time, because there's natural variation in nutrients, even if they're cooked exactly the same; maybe one apple was out of season, or maybe that orchard had a rough summer, whatever. There's too much of a margin of error in both nutrition values and individual recommendations to take this information as absolute truth.

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Have you ever done any study of nutrition?  I'd highly recommend such if you choose an unconventional, little tested diet like a vegan diet as there are numerous nutrition based diseases (e.g., scurvy, rickets, etc.).

Yup.

Master of Science in a health profession, with continuing ed/ work experience teaching people with disabilities (ie adults with mild Down's or CP who have grocery shopping and/ or parenting roles)  how to meet nutritional requirements/ interpret food labels.

Also since going veg-- like a lotta folks here-- have sought out info from varied vegan RD sources in order to educate myself re: thriving on a vegan diet. When others' conclusions differ from yours-- being, for example, unconvinced that a GNC shake-free vegan diet does not guarantee weight loss and eating disorders -- it doesn't mean they've never studied nutrition. It sometimes means that their conclusions simply differ from yours.

It's best to just make peace with this phenomenon; it is quite likely to reoccur.

See definition 2. http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/condescension

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You might not be selling anything, but your are self-promoting a program on this website for free.

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... isolated soy protein for about half of a vegan's daily protein consumption was the only way I could find to get the minimum recommend amount of lysine.  You are welcome to try to get it another way.  If you find another way, please let me know how you achieved such.

Your body does not have strict operating hours, like a bank or something; you don't have to have exactly 100% of each nutrient in each 24 period, else lose the opportunity to absorb it! So obsessing about each microgram of each thing at each meal is just a hobby, if you like to do it; but I already play the guitar, and garden a little, so feel no need to do so. With each nutrient, some days more, some days less... your body understands averaging! Or, well, mine does, according to the MD who's been doing my physicals since I went veg.

Also, you seem to be advertizing a website by posting a website link.  I know it is free and everything, but Tweety might get on your ass about it.  Actually, given that it is a ".com" website link, it might not even be free.  It might contain advertizing for other ".com" sites!  Worse yet, they might contain links for other ".com" sites, and so on, and so on.  Do you realize what you've done? !!!

;)

Variety, man, variety! Share links, if they're interesting or relevant, by all means; but if I referred you to Miriam-Webster in every post, because I had designed the dictionary and wanted everyone to read it, I think you and Tweety would both be within your rights to call bullshit. ;-)

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... isolated soy protein for about half of a vegan's daily protein consumption was the only way I could find to get the minimum recommend amount of lysine.  You are welcome to try to get it another way.  If you find another way, please let me know how you achieved such.

Your body does not have strict operating hours, like a bank or something; you don't have to have exactly 100% of each nutrient in each 24 period, else lose the opportunity to absorb it! So obsessing about each microgram of each thing at each meal is just a hobby, if you like to do it; but I already play the guitar, and garden a little, so feel no need to do so. With each nutrient, some days more, some days less... your body understands averaging! Or, well, mine does, according to the MD who's been doing my physicals since I went veg.

Also, you seem to be advertizing a website by posting a website link.  I know it is free and everything, but Tweety might get on your ass about it.  Actually, given that it is a ".com" website link, it might not even be free.  It might contain advertizing for other ".com" sites!  Worse yet, they might contain links for other ".com" sites, and so on, and so on.  Do you realize what you've done? !!!

;)

Variety, man, variety! Share links, if they're interesting or relevant, by all means; but if I referred you to Miriam-Webster in every post, because I had designed the dictionary and wanted everyone to read it, I think you and Tweety would both be within your rights to call bullshit. ;-)

I had a grandfather that lived to almost 100 years old.  He ate TV dinners every single night for dinner, oatmeal everyday for breakfast, and gargled with an iodine solution.  He was healthy until the day he died.  He died in his sleep too.  Don't talk to me about variety.

"Don't talk to me about life."
-- Marvin, Hichhiker's Guide To The Galaxy

I think she was saying that posting links is awesome, appreciated and encouraged if you are posting different things (aka, variety) relevant to the conversation at that point in time (or not, whatever).  What is being discouraged here is posting the same link in several comments, repeatedly. 
I also feel as if people would be more willing to use your program if you would just be up front about  your credentials.  If you were to just come out and say "Hey guys, I study nutrition as a hobby and I wrote a program, I'd like it if you all checked it out and gave me feedback", or "I have a PhD in nutrition and I wrote a program I'd like you to take a look at", I think you'd generate a lot more interest.

I'll go back to quietly reading the thread now. Carry on :)

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LOL

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I already stated it, but, hesp knows nutrition. It's what she does. She knows what's up.

There are loads of raw foodists (I am not one of them), so you'd have to ask them if it's reasonable to eat 32 c of raw food a day.

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I already stated it, but, hesp knows nutrition. It's what she does. She knows what's up.

There are loads of raw foodists (I am not one of them), so you'd have to ask them if it's reasonable to eat 32 c of raw food a day.

Can you please send me hesp's profile.  A search of vegweb yielded nothing about this user.

http://jaymankita.com/they_lied_jay_mankita.mp3

We don't want these corporate nutcases to know who she is.

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Actually, as I stated, I'm not talking to you about variety.  I'm addressing things you say, but since you're not listening, I'm talking to the lurkers out there whom might need some sound advice. 

Obviously there are folks out there that defy all logic...people that smoke until they are 100, don't wear seatbelts, eat and thrive only on Big Macs.    Still for some of us not blessed with those genes, a varied diet that includes lots of different plant based foods is the best.

I like Wikipedia and use them often for information, but anyone can post information on there and it isn't the best source for hard core facts.  In my opinion.

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s320x320/313299_189591914448192_126894987384552_422467_568415203_n.jpg

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As for genetics, I think it plays a much smaller roll than learned behavior in determining one's lifespan, in general.  There is also "luck".  I'd estimate the percentages each plays, but I know most people are notoriously bad at estimating such things.

You make a good case for not taking any chances and taking matters into one's owns hand.  In my case, this involves using a common sense approach to nutrition that works for me and not limiting myself to a set menu other than it include whole vegan foods.

...Because you can't argue with all the fools in the world. It's easier to let them have their way, then trick them when they're not paying attention.”
― Christopher Paolini, Eragon

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"Perception is strong and sight weak. In strategy it is important to see distant things as if they were close and to take a distanced view of close things."

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Like peak oil, and the fact that diesel/biodiesel, which harvests most of our food, could be real problem for our children or our children's children, unless they kill them (or more likely us) off or we find a solution that will actually work

Yes that.
An artist's duty is rather to stay open-minded and in a state where he can receive information and inspiration. You always have to be ready for that little artistic Epiphany.
Nick Cave

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In my quest to include variety I'd bought some amaranth a few months ago.  Finally used some of it (see food porn in 1000 Vegan recipes section of the cookbook forum).  I discovered a nice tidbit I thought I'd pass on:
"Amaranth is an excellent source of lysine, an important amino acid (protein). Grains are notorious for low lysine content, which decreases the quality of their proteins. The high lysine content in amaranth sets it apart from other grains. Food scientists consider the protein content of amaranth of high "biological value", similar in fact, to the proteins found in milk. This means that amaranth contains an excellent combination of essential amino acids and is well absorbed in the intestinal tract."

http://glutenfreecooking.about.com/od/nutritionmealplanning/a/amaranth.htm

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That's not how genetic modification works, and only so many products are currently genetically modified.

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This thread is kind of like a train wreck: incomprehensible to those who happen along after the fact, but you just can't stop staring.

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This thread is kind of like a train wreck: incomprehensible to those who happen along after the fact, but you just can't stop staring.

ROFLMAO, I know right?

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Amaranth (boiled, drained) is 5.166% lysine per gram of protein.  It is also close to 2/3 carbs and 1/3 protein with just a real little bit of fat, at least if quinn's calculations are correct.  Of course, I'm sure the version they are talking about could have been genetically engineered with the gene of a cow or something to produce more lysine (or maybe less)

Take it or leave it, I did think it interesting and was just pointing out to folks that a variety of foods have what you need without having to rely on a commercially processed powder.

It's a grain/seed, so yeah it's high carbs, but you eat macaroni and oats so I gather you're not carb-phobic.  Then again, I'm not lysine obsessed so perhaps I'm missing the point.

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You realize, of course, that by your own logic nothing you say here is remotely interesting or meaningful... you're posting on vegweb.com, in case it slipped your mind.  ;D

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I think, at least from a health stand point, it is really a variety of nutrients our bodies need, not too little of some and not too much of others.  The variety of foods is more of a taste / personal preferences issue.  The former is more of a science, the later more of an art.  They are not necessarily incompatible.

Sorry, my mistake, I was looking at amaranth leaves, not the grain.  The grain is actually 6.482% lysine for each gram of protein, but only around 20% protein, according to quinn.  To error is human.  To really f*ck things up it takes a computer.  With the various assortment of ".com" sites on the Internet, even more so.

Yeah, it's a grain, not a protein, so that it's "only 20%" isn't an issue with me.

For me, my wide variety approach to eating isn't just a taste/personal preference issue.  It's a way of easily assuring that I'm getting a wide variety of nutrients and amino acids and not just the major ones.

I'll get off my broken record approach, but say again variety, variety, variety.

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Don't need to pressure bioengineers mother nature is just fine. 

Lysine is a good treatment for herpes, is that why the obsession with just one essential amino acid.  Is there something you want to tell us?  How much lysine does your mighty quinn say is in black beans?  Just curious.

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